Talk:Cadia

Why is "top fashions in Cadia are camo patterns and body armor" considered bad?

It's a sign of Cadia's oppressive, gloomy, and all-encompassing militarism, which is a terrible way to live.

Where is this from?

>NOPE! While Cadia does indeed fall, the world (despite what the artwork would say) is NOT destroyed, Abby crashes a Blackstone Fortress into Cadia to try and kill Creed and the last defenders and stop the pylons from pushing back the Eye of Terror, and it worked, kinda. While it failed to kill Creed, it did cause great tectonic upheaval making the planet indefensible and wiped out the Cadian Pylons, causing the Eye of Terror to expand and envelop Cadia, however most of the defenders managed to get off world after this happened, with Creed and the Cadian 8th staying behind to Hold The Line against the infinite tide of daemons that were pouring into Cadia as it slowly became a daemon world. In short, the planet broke before the Imperial Guard did!

Is this from the Fall of Cadia book? It seems to contradict the initial leaks, but since I haven't seen the full book I can't be entirely sure. That said, I definitely remember seeing that there were only 4 million Imperial survivors out of the original 850 million Imperials present so the claim about "90% of the Cadian Shock Troopers surviving" is definitely bullshit.--Newerfag (talk) 04:00, 22 January 2017 (UTC)

That is indeed from the Fall of Cadia book, though in that book it's unclear whether or not the planet was going to break apart at the end, both the Imperials and Chaos forces abandon it before they could find out since it had lost all value for both sides. -- Triacom (talk) 13:52, 22 January 2017 (UTC)

I don't know about "90% of Cadian Shock Troopers surviving", but the Regimental Standard says "with around 90% of Cadia’s forces off-world on tours around the galaxy at any given time", which is a completely different thing. Of course, given that The Regimental Standard is basically the sequel to the Imperial Infantryman's Uplifting Primer, that statistic is possibly bullshit, too, but it is true that Cadian Shock Troopers are stated in the fluff to be used like, everywhere. TiamatRoar (talk) 20:22, 22 January 2017 (UTC)

I remember the 7e IG codex specifically mentioned that every single Cadian regiment was called back to Cadia at Creed's orders. Unless GW produces some kind of evidence to the contrary, it's safe to assume most of the Cadian regiments were wiped out bar for the ones that escaped with the Triumvirate and Black Templars.--Newerfag (talk) 20:27, 22 January 2017 (UTC)

Ah. Well, I'll take your word for it then and fix things accordingly. TiamatRoar (talk) 01:40, 23 January 2017 (UTC)

On Stormtroopers

Perhaps some day the Imperium will realize that careful selection of soldiers could result in the entire Imperial Guard being nothing but Kasrkin (and their equivalents in armored regiments). But again, that would mean the Imperium would win easily and no models would be sold. Without selling models, the Imperium cannot continue fighting the Eternal War and that would be HERESY. Alternatively massed flashlight are simply far more cost effective then elite shock troupers, especially when needing to garrison millions of worlds. Likewise even a space marine cannot survive being outnumbered 1000 or even a 100 to 1 by cannon fodder standing in front of artillery. Except Kasrkin’s only real equipment difference is the hellgun, but their skill is what makes them dangerous. It is not more expensive, simply being selective of recruits. Even if it was more expensive, there is this miraculous thing called “cost effectiveness”. A soldier capable of doing the job of a squad or even platoon of normal soldiers but cost only maybe three to five times more than a normal soldier but you can field about one for every ten or so normal soldiers, then you enjoy a massive gain. Also, quantity and quality are not interchangeable. A thousand soldiers fighting a thousand soldiers are about evenly matched, but a thousand soldiers fighting a hundred who are each worth ten is going to lose because that power will be concentrated. That hundred men can break through any assault, destroy any target when they attack, and it is much more difficult to force them to face an open battle of mere numbers. You simply aren’t going to be fighting that hundred with your thousand because they just won’t sit around and let you. This is a large part of why Space Marines are so effective. They simply win and don’t get bogged down into a game of attrition unless it is in their best interest. And you won’t need as many troops in garrisons if the troops are higher quality and won’t need as many garrisons if your enemies are too dead to attack. Besides, soldiers who survive a battle don't need to be replaced. You don't have to replace their wargear, train more, transport them, etc. and the wait for reinforcements and the expenses that comes with it becomes unnecessary when reinforcements are unnecessary. Modern armies try to equip their soldiers the best they can not because they value those soldiers' lives over much but because it works the best. If sending them in naked and unarmed worked better but they'd die in droves, that's what would be done. Winning is more important and soldiers are expected to die for victory anyway.

I moved this here because it's "point, counterpoint" the paragraph and honestly does not need to be in the page because it completely forgets about logistics and the wars that were being fought. It doesn't matter if you have the best trained troops in the galaxy, if they're not where they need to be then they cannot help, and the whole point of mass-training the recruits is because they need to be everywhere. Thousands of worlds repeatedly fall under xenos predation or are suddenly caught in a chaos uprising, that trying to be really selective with wargear and training becomes more of a pipe dream than anything else. Even the Cadians are only as trained as they are out of necessity, since all of them started training when they were children and the rest of the Guard is mostly adult inductees. This also doesn't mean the rest of the Guard are terrible, they're just not as experienced by comparison and they're also as trained as they need to be for their relative tasks, as the Imperial Guard books have repeatedly shown they're not incompetent, that's a joke that only arose via how easily they die on the tabletop (and when you consider who they're fighting, that's not surprising in the least). The whole paragraph acts as if the Imperial Guard don't receive any training as a whole, as such it should not have been written. -- Triacom (talk) 00:06, 13 January 2019 (UTC)