Talk:Codex - Tau Auxiliary

Questions

• About the warlord trait, Previous Contracts. Prefered enemy already applies to the entire unit If a character in that unit has prefered enemy. Does the rule mean that the unit the warlord joins still have prefered enemy even after the character leaves the unit? The wording makes it sound so.

No, that would be my mistake, I meant it to mean that if an Independent Character was switching between units then any unit he joins gain the Preferred Enemy USR, and his previous unit loses it, I make plenty of mistakes with these rules.

• How are Drones on the Drop sentinals supposed to work? Are they like normal vehicle drones, were they are embarked until they want to hop off? Are they supposed to join the unit and make an odd combo of infantry and walkers? --Bobthe6th (talk) 20:07, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

I would assume the same way as other Tau/Tau Aligned Vehicles (embarked), but Dragoon is the one who designed the Sentinel so he's the one we need to ask The Greater Meh (talk) 23:39, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

They are attached to the side of the sentinal like princess leia hair

• What's the plan with 8th incoming? Are you going to abandon this page and are you going to make a version for 8th? (Initiative values are out Movement values are in, Armour Values and Hull Points are replaced with Toughness and Wound values, no vehicle damage table, MCs and Vehicles become weaker when they lose wounds.) I suppose the work horses of this project might want to check with their groups for what they are going to do going forward, though I don't imagine anyone is going to quit because of the new edition? Angry Pirate (talk) 19:50, 27 April 2017 (UTC)

I have literally no clue, I'm waiting for 8th to hit fully first (after I buy all the codex's that people are going to throw away so I can still play 7th 'cause I like 7th) so I can get the fullest idea of what exactly I'm going to be dealing with. Then I'll most likely make the changes that are needed. The Greater Meh (talk) 21:12, 27 April 2017 (UTC)

I do fully intend on updating the two Fandexes under my wing. I'll be contributing to rebalancing Tau Auxiliary and Knights Inductor once 8th edition rolls around and I've had the chance to read into it to know what I'm doing. For my time, I'm going to first update Knights Inductor with an initial patch, and then go into patching up Tau Auxiliary to be compatible. From there on it'll probably take a couple hours of discovery and changing out of some things. Evil Executive, CEO of Evil Incorporated (talk) 23:17, 27 April 2017 (UTC)

Layout and Style

• Invulnerable save and armour saves are never capitalized, Armour Save always is. armour saves are conferred not granted. These are the standard capitalization conventions of modern 40k codices. Given that the rules you made for when something should be capitalized was not unilatterally enforced, I used the standard layout of the official 7th ed codices. - Pirate Bot

Oof, that can't have been fun covering that. Thanks man. The Greater Meh (talk) 23:45, 12 February 2017 (UTC)

More fun than writing a Renegades and Heretics codex... Angry Pirate (talk) 00:30, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

Other Races

I've been doing a similar personal project, would you like me to stick up what I've written on The Galg, The Tarellians, The Morrallians, Vespids, and The Thraxians?

Sure go for it. I actually was going to ask if you wanted to add the Tarellian's to the list later on. -dragoon508

Excellent -Groggarioth-

It'll probably take me a couple of days to format everything from word to this site, until then it'll look like a mess -Groggarioth-

Vespid stuff up - Groggarioth-

Galg stuff up, but still being edited -Groggarioth-

Morrallian stuff up -Groggarioth-

The Thraxian stuff is going to take some time, the official fluff is kinda thin, (Chitin Covered, Multi-Armed, doesn't even say if they're humanoid, so my guess is that they're an Insectoid species) and my idea for how to take it may have been a little too complex. May be a couple of weeks at the earliest Groggarioth

This is the only thing I found image wise when I checked it out. So this may help [1] They do not even have an entry in the Lexcanium or 40k wiki as of now. So this may be a tougher one.

They got one, as in one sentence [2], I was trying to make a variable army where one of the core rules was adding in a species based phenotype rule (Dragonfly, Moth, Ant, Roach, and Beetle) wherein each Unit could vary depending on how you wanted to build an army. I'll Make one fan-dex based on that idea, and one based on the image you just gave me, hopefully it should be interesting.

So something similar to the Kroot merc list then? Probably will end up pretty cool then.

This may help us with the Visual style of the Races to be honest. Pulled this up by chance while looking for some pictures. Seems that it honestly may be what all the races look like, or at least most of them [3]

Is that one on the bottom left a Hrud? I thought they didn't exist. Groggarioth

I think that would be more along the lines of what I think a Morellion would look like. a Hrud looks like they do on their page -dragoon508

So Who or What is that Vampire looking idiot on the right? Hrenian? Greet? Formosian?

I dunno but I suppose we could say those are the Pakasar or N'deemi, since both of those races where conquered by the Tau. Make a bit more sense if they were scary ass vampires in that case. For the Greet since they are basically like a fish people. I think that they probably look like the fish with the long tongue in the lower right.

Bottom middle may be the Brachyura. The six legs then the box is being held by two pincers. Ranghon is kind of the one on the middle left with the gun, although I envision them more like the dryads for fantasy. The Upper right of the Morellion one (or at least what I think they probably look like) would be a Anthrazods. I would think their body would have thick hide like a rhino that grows harder and thicker as they age.

Keep in mid besides that artwork being offical. The races I am thinking it represents are not offical. Just what I think may kind of fit. dragoon508

Fair enough. I do like the Morrallian art, I was imagining them as a mix of Kreigers (Imperial Guard), Stalkers from the zone (S.T.A.L.K.E.R), and those weird Gas Mask aliens from Mass Effect. With this I drop the Krieg influence, and put in Hrud instead, so we've got Small "Rattish" people wearing heavy MOPP Suits, with the sleek, angular armour of the Tau, and a slight influence from the Quarians from Mass Effect (Mostly the Gasmask/Hood)

Alright so I am going to take a couple days to recharge my creative energies. Burnt out on coming up with some stuff. But I have some stuff in mind for the Hrenian and Formosians. The Hrenian are apparently just light infantry so thinking of a mobile stealthy force in that regard. Small squads but they have a high cover save for instance. Formosians will be more of a blob army with low leadership.

I got an idea for an Earth Caste Engineer who will basically play sort of like a techpriest and a Water Caste Liason that can be taken if you take an auxillary HQ with a Tau codex HQ. So will finish this idea up and post it in a seperate section.Dragoon508 (talk) 09:41, 15 March 2015 (UTC)

Races that still need to be done

A quick list of what races have nothing on them yet for reference

• N'deemi: Conquered by the Tau, probably will be a more warlike race possibly one of the races looking like that gargoyle vampire picture. Other than that nothing is written about them Done

• Greet: Most likely will not show up in the codex since they are aquatic. Maybe add in an upgrade to other units that they can take.

• Brachyura: Probably too small as well but unsure. All we really know of the race is they help the earth caste with their plasma generators.

• Hrenian: Technically not a part of the Empire but one of their mercs like the Tarellian Dog Soldiers and Galgs. I am thinking they will be a stealthy force with smaller unit size and probably fleet. Done

• We might want to do the Loxatl as well, as they've worked with the Tau [[4]]

For the Loxatl they do not work with the Tau much, or at least not enough to be considered an allied race. However when I get around to it the Loxatl are one of the races that will show up in Codex- Mercs, along with eldar outcasts, Ork Freebooterz, and some other mercenary races.

Do you mind if I take the N'Deemi, Pakasar, and the Hrenians? Groggarioth 00:27 March 14 2015 (UK)

Go for it. I had some ideas for the Hrenians but if you got ideas then go ahead. I will just add to it if I find something to add then Dragoon508 (talk) 02:25, 14 March 2015 (UTC)

I had an idea for the Pakasar, both they and the N'Deemi are warlike, but there's only one picture for 2 races, however we do have another warlike race that hasn't really appeared much in the Fluff since their introduction, The Saharduin, whose worlds exist in the Ultima Segmentum, and were largely just contained by the Imperium due to both their hostility and tech level, the Tau have access to Deep Ocean equipment, wouldn't call them the same thing as the imperium, and are located in the Ultima Segmentum, the fluff lines up with a little bit of nudging and poking. So the N'Deemi could be the Winged, Gargoyle, Vampire looking dude in the picture, and the Pakasar could be the Saharduin who've been rolled into the Tau Empire, what do you think? Groggarioth 16:34, March 14th, 2015 (UK)

With the Saharduin you will most likely be opening yourself up to a lot of skub. Like a shit ton.I caution that but ultimately it is up to you on this regardDragoon508 (talk) 19:57, 14 March 2015 (UTC)

• Why does every race the Tau ever conquered need to be represented? If you try to represent everyone you'll just end up in a scenario where tons of units are useless because their job is done much better by somebody else, not to mention some races would probably be used purely for economic purposes, ie in charge of supplying the Tau with goods rather than front-line troops. -- Triacom (talk) 19:40, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

It is why the greet, Nagi, and Brachyura will not show up as actual units.Dragoon508 (talk) 00:05, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

[5]Here is a homebrew race that came from an Auxiliary thread called the Hrenian. Their big theme is radioactivity, their home world had a lot of fissile materials and so they are adapted to endure massive amounts of radiation. All of their weapons work on nuclear power, and so everything has the rad rule. think they might be an interesting addition.

I likes it, we've already got the Hrenians in here, I based them around a small, tactically flexible scouting force, although with the Formosian Pod Born, we could fluff something similar, and make it that Formosian's do this, and just change the species name, how's that sound? - Groggarioth - The Greater Meh (talk) 16:34, 30 April 2015 (UTC)

Okay, with a bit of reading up & in the interest of not having to delete anything just yet, we could fit them in as Thexians [[6]], seeing A) Thexians hold a lot of sway with the Nicassar & Loxatl (Both of whom have worked for or with the Tau), giving them a connection & B) They are manipulators, and would probably try to find positions of power within the Tau Empire to turn the Tau to their own needs, giving them motivation & C) They're said to be Elite soldiers, from heavily Oxidised Worlds called the Blood Moon, giving strength to the whole Radiation & Lava thing, however we have A LOT of stuff here so I'm hesitant to put them in as it is now, will wait for Dragoon508's & Ilniaj's Votes -Groggarioth-

Formosian's main focus was a low leadership race. So my thoughts were that the trueborn of the race don't really fight. They just clone a ton of people and send them out to fight for the race. However the Hrenians look good but my main thing against them is that we sort of have radiation stuff in a few other codexs with the most prominant right now the Skitarii and with the Krieg. Plus we also see this with the Morellions who deal with radiation and hazard material Dragoon508 (talk) 09:23, 17 June 2015 (UTC)

Vespid

You got some good things for the Vesipid but the hive guard needs to be nerfed a bit. Drop down the leaders leadership to 9, since leader 10 should stick to just hq units.

I am not sure if the queen can be leader 11 by the way. I think it caps at 10

The XV-48 is just really weird and seems out of place. Seems like something out of macross more than anything. I would suggest taking it out to be perfectly honest, keep the battlesuits to the Tau only. Other races can pilot battle suits if they are in the fire caste. -dragoon508

Fair enough, dropped the Queen Guard's Ld down to 9,

I always thought that since you rolled 2d6 for Ld tests then the lowest would be 2 (1+1), and the highest that still involved a chance of failure would be 11 (6+6 being the only chance of failure), still dropped Queen's Ld to 10

The XV-48 was as much a thought experiment as an actual unit, kinda like how would I make a Unit that swapped between altitudes like the suits from "Code Geass R2", while making use of the Vespid's natural aptitude towards flying, if you don't want it there (and for good reason, I'll admit it's out of place, and kinda goofy) then I'll remove it and keep it removed. -Groggarioth-

The XV-48 just seems really goofy for a vespid to run. However it may be a good idea for an air caste unit instead. Maybe have the origins as a Tau space fighter that transforms to place charges on the hull of a ship. Would be something that would fit there a bit better.

Try posting it here instead: battlesuit

As for the leadership thing of 11. I have never seen any stats for leadership at 11 and I think I remember reading in the 5 edition rulebook that you can't make a stat over 10. So that is where I got that from. Even still Primarchs do not even have over 10 leadership so that may be the best baseline there.-user:dragoon508

For the hive barge is it open topped or any specific access points? I just put it down as the sides and rear when I was editing. Also I have it in my mind that it is a big ass blimp flying around. Dunno if that is what it is supposed to be but that is what I am thinking of. Dragoon508 (talk) 01:34, 6 March 2015 (UTC)

Have you ever played the recent X-Com game? Think the Alien Supply Barge from that game, but not as large, and without a loading area at the back, a separate bridge, or all the different traverse routes. Found the link, this ship [[7]], without the rear section, or the walkways surrounding the cargo hold

Vespid Named Character

wanting to make a Vespid Named Character, either a Famous Warlord who specialises in duels, or a Queen who has been rendered barren, and has taken to the battlefield instead, thoughts on the matter -Groggarioth-

Do a queen, it probably will fit better. Or do one for each.Dragoon508 (talk) 07:45, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

Got a Royal Champion done

Ex’el’zior, Queen’s Champion (Jump Infantry, Independent Character)

 WS | BS | S | T | W | I | A | Ld | Sv
  5 |  5 | 4 | 5 | 4 | 8 | 5 | 10 | 3+

Wargear

• 2 Queen’s Stingers (Melee, S+2, AP2, Poisoned 2+, Master crafted)
• Focused Neutron Blaster (Range 18”, S:7, AP2, Assault 1)
• 2 Vials of Queen’s Honey (One Use only, Natural Steroid)
• Warlord Combat Armour
• Blacksun Filter

Special Rules

• Independent Character
• Blur – This model’s movement is increased by 3”, this rule also grants the Fleet USR.
• Hit & Run
• Stealth (Ruins)
• Move Through Cover
• Natural Steroid – This item may be used in the movement phase, until the start of the controlling players next movement phase Ex’el’zior gains either, +1 S, +1 T, FnP (4+), Armour 2+, or the ability to run and charge in the same turn.

Vespid Yellowjackets

So while I was working on the Named Characters for the Vespid, I had an idea, I mentioned somewhere in the Hive Guardian entry that only some Vespid soldiers can take the transformation that Royal jelly makes them experience, so what happens to the others, do they remain the same, become permanently crippled, or turn into the Hulk, my vote is for Hulk, and here are their stats

Yellowjacket Hornet Soldiers (Heavy Support, Jump Infantry, cost 90 Points, Unit Composition 1 Yellowjacket Hornets)

For every 10 Hive guardians exposed to the mixture of steroids and proteins that turns them into Queen Guardian, 5 will reject the transformation, becoming violently ill before returning to normal, 2 will transform into Queen Guardians as intended and the other 3 will find their minds subsumed by the mix of endorphins and adrenaline that floods their body, transforming them beyond queen Guardians at the cost of their minds.

Called Yellowjackets these Vespid are far larger and stronger than their brethren, however they are only able to follow the simplest of instructions, making them unsuitable for the more complex work found in the Neutron Crystal Processing Factories, as such they are often used as entertainment, pitting one or more Hive Guardians against them in an arranged fight.

In times of combat the Yellowjackets are released onto the battlefield ahead of the rest of the Vespid forces, their ferocity, strength and size acting as a distraction while the rest of the Vespid force deploys.

Yellowjacket Hornet (Jump Infantry)

 WS | BS | S | T | W | I | A | Ld | Sv
  5 |  - | 5 | 6 | 4 | 5 | 4 |  3 | 4+

Wargear

• Hornet Lance (Melee, S+2/user, AP 2/4, Two-Handed, Strikedown, Poisoned 3+)
• Combat Armour (Armour 4+)

Special Rules

• Move through Cover
• Stealth (Ruins)
• Fleet
• Mindless Fury – A Yellowjacket Hornet is immune to fear, and may Run & Charge in the same turn, but they must always move towards the closest enemy unit, cannot choose to use “Our Weapons are Useless”, and may not willingly fall back or flee combat.

Options

• May take up to 2 additional Yellowjacket Hornets (90 Points/model)
• 1 Yellowjacket Hornet may be equipped by a Positional Relay & Homing Beacon (15 Points)

so, 75 points for something that dies to 1 krakk missile. Tyranid warriors aren't great for a reason. If you are basically making a monstrous creature, make a monstrous creature with T6, and FnP. This is currently a massive waste of points.

Well I'm kinda worried about making it too good, so no MC, but Toughness 6 should work for +15 points increase, and it can get FnP from a Vespid Queen. 21:42, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

Nicassar

How on Terra do 10 giant floating Space bears, fit on a hover sled that only needs 2 Kroot Hounds to pull?

I mean I could see 1, but 10? -Groggarioth- From what I have seen the Nicassar are like a mix of a squid and a slug. As for how they are able, well it is just like how you can pull a barge with peaple on it down the river with a donkey. -dragoon508

http://1d4chan.org/wiki/Nicassar

Jervis Johnson, describes them as "Sort of like very flat polar bears", and while this isn't totally 100% official, it's the closest thing we've got -Groggarioth-

I was going off of this pic from advanced tau tactica [8] I will come up with something different then later then. Got to rethink how I want to approach them then

Don't worry too much, I was looking around for pictures to put in this Fan-dex, and the Nicassar pictures had 2 distinct styles of creatures, so I dug and dug. If you find any official depictions of the Races I've stuck in here that conflict with the stuff I've been putting up, well... That Slug-Like Creature puts me more in mind of a "Nagi" than anything else, so you could just switch over the race, change the currant fluff, and make some new Nicassar stuff, rather than scrapping the whole thing and starting from scratch. Groggarioth

Only thing I think I would have to scrap as a transport would be the sled. May make it an upgrade for the captain instead. Just got to come up with a new transport option. To be fair I still got ideas for all the things I have done so far just working on how I want to put it.

Side note on the Nagi. They are too small I think to properly be in the codex. So may make it a war gear option that an etheral can take. LEt me think of something in that regard dragoon508

So I think that besides giving the captain the option to take the sled. The race as is will probably stay the same. Probably going to make a skiff sorta like a dark elder one for a dedicated transport along with a psycic discipline for them, but aside from that nothing more. This is one of the races that really is not battlefield equipped besides their psyker power.

So I got to thinking on what this skiff would be like for the Nicassar, then I realized that I do not have the new codex for dark eldar so no real reference for this. If someone wants to put together a dedicated transport for the Nicassar that would help.

Nicassar Unique Discipline

Question, would it be worth giving the Nicassar their own Psychic Discipline based around Movement & Exploration?

If so should it be based around granting stuff like move through cover, night vision, outflanking, re-rolling reserves, and allowing Vehicles extra movement speed? Groggarioth

Would be a good idea I think, however I would have to mull over what to put in it before I put down anything concrete. Need to fix them up a bit as well because of the new lore I found, aka they are not slug/squid people. Want to finish what I plan for the Ranghon before I do anything for them. -dragoon508

This one I was struggling on how I wanted the powers to be. Been mulling it over and over but unlike the other power table this one has just been consuming my time with nothing really coming from it. So I am going to put down my basic ideas here and anyone can comment on what should be added or taken out. This way I will concentrate on something else. Good names for the stuff is also needed.Dragoon508 (talk) 04:51, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Void-Sight of the Nicassar

Power Number	Power Name	Charge Level	Description
Primaris Power	Ferry of the Nicassar	Warp Charge 1	Using the powers that the Nicasssar have developed to propel their ships in the void, the caster uses a mere glimmer of that power to help speed the journey of a vehicle. Target Vehicle can move an extra 6" at Combat speed for one turn. Range 18"
1	Telekentic plow	Warp Charge 1	Pushing the terrain aside with their powers the caster helps ease the journey of the target. Unit gains move through cover.
2	Guidance home	Warp Charge 1	Caster helps bring a deep striking party to the ground safely with their powers. Caster prevents deepstrike mishaps within 6" until next psykic phase
3	Telekinetic weapon	Warp Charge 1	Using their telekinetic powers, the caster fights with their melee weapon at range. Melee weapon of your choice makes a ranged attack. Range 12"
4	Escape Through The Void	Warp Charge 3	Using their mastery of Telekinesis, the Nicassar pulls a Vehicle from real-space, moving it to a far away spot in a matter of moments. Target vehicle is placed in reserves and can arrive next turn within 12" of any side of the board.
5	No Portal Barred	Warp Charge 2	Through sheer force of will the Nicassar caster, move any intervening terrain from its current real-space position for long enough to allow a vehicle to pass.A Single Vehicle may pass through Difficult terrain, Dangerous Terrain, or Impassable terrain with no ill effects until the next Psychic Phase
6	Telekinetic pull	Warp Charge 2	Using the vast power of their telekinetic prowess the Nicaassar helps speed the travel of their allies. Psyker pulls a unit from the reserves and lets them outflank or deepstrike as the casters choice.

Put in powers 4 & 5, what do you think? Groggarioth (talk) 20:46, 11 March 2015 (UK)

I do not like the No Portal Barred one. Seems a cheap way to get rid of cover bonus to be shot to death. For instance pop this one and remove a piece of cover that the tank is hiding behind, and use a railgun on itDragoon508 (talk) 21:52, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Well the redone version was my original idea, but the main problem there is that the movement phase comes before the Psychic phase, so you're pumping 2 points into a vehicle, hoping it'll survive until the next turn when it can make use of the powers it has been bestowed with Groggarioth (talk) 23:13, 11 March 2015 (UK)

Maybe we should switch the place of it then. Maybe switch Telkentic weapon with its position. With a lower warp charge count.

Nicassar Transport

So doing some thinking on the Nicassar, and the fact that they are pretty reliant on transport, especially when they make ground-fall. So I though this might be a good idea.

Put it into the codex, I think we got a good one. However I would drop the side armor to 11. Dragoon508 (talk) 07:44, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

Nicassar Tow, 120 Points, Dedicated Transport, Skimmer

While the Larger Nicassar Elder's may be remarkably powerful Telekinetic Pyskers, Nicassar Clan members are often reliant on working as a group to move their ships, with multiple members provide thrust, with a single member acting as a pilot, when it comes to ground based craft a pair of Nicassar can control the Nicassar Tow, carrying a much larger group from place to place where they may explore new alien planets, or provide psychic support to their allies.

BS | FAV | SAV | RAV | HP
 3 |  12 |  11 |  10 |  2

Unit: Vehicle, Skimmer

Weaponry: Burst Cannon

Transport Capacity 5 Nicassar Clansman, or 1 Nicassar Elder

Access Points: Rear

Fire Ports: None

Special Rules: Psyker Mastery level 1 (May Take powers from the "Telekinesis" or "Void-Sight of the Nicassar" Disciplines)

Psychic Engine - May spend one point during the Pschic Phase, it may then either move 6" immediately, Increase it's cover save from Jink by +1 until the controlling players next turn, or remove an immobilised condition.

END

What do you think Groggarioth (talk) 19:42, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

Chaos Wierdness

Something has been bothering me about the Nicassar for a while now.

Why do the Tau have so little knowledge of Chaos/Daemons when their deep in with Nicassar, a race of incredibly potent psykers, at least one of them should have fallen to the Warp when in the presence of the Tau, and rumours have a way of spreading. with this in mind I've got a couple of theories.

1 - The Ethereals are really good at suppressing rumours

2 - When a Nicassar falls, everything, EVERYTHING dies in what can be assumed to be a black hole of telekinesis

3- The Nicassar do not draw power from the warp (Much like the Tyranids or Orks don't draw their psychic power from the Warp) but instead draw on the intrinsic power found the vast expanse of space, or the heart of stars.

it's with the Theory 3 that I came up with the following unit, designed to give less straight access to the Divination discipline

Nicassar Void-Touched Savants (Elite, Infantry, 35 Points)

The only Psyker race known to the Tau, the Nicassar are kept secret from the Imperium of Man, as the Tau who’ve seen how the Imperium treats its own Psykers fear that the Imperiums overpowering Xenophobia would be brought to bear on the Tau Empire for harbouring the Nicassar.

However while the Imperium’s fear of Psykers comes from their relation to the Warp, the Nicassar, an entire race of Psykers, have never had one of their own fall to the Warp, or be directly tainted by Chaos.

The current working theory made by the other Psyker races that have made contact with the Nicassar, is that the Nicassar do not actually make use of the warp, but instead their long exposure to the empty void of space has instead allowed them to evolve the ability to manipulate the forces found in these great voids of nothingness, which has given them their seemingly telekinetic abilities.

However this ability has manifested itself differently in a small subset of the Nicassar, called the Savants, who are often responsible for calculating the fleet’s journey, sensing areas of inhospitable space, and other such tasks that are necessary to aid in the Nicassars exploration of the Galaxy. Rarely Savants will develop the ability to generate other abilities, such as the Star-Touched, who gain the ability to freely manipulate heat & flame, or the Life-Touched who have such an innate understanding of their species biology that they are capable of temporarily altering their psychical capabilities.

Name	WS	BS	S	T	W	I	A	Ld	Sv
Void-Touched Savant	2	3	2	3	2	3	1	9	4+
Star-Touched Savant	2	3	2	3	2	3	1	9	4+
Mind-Touched Savant	2	3	2	3	2	3	1	9	4+

Wargear

• Combat Armour
• Pulse Pistol

Special Rules

• Psyker (Master Level 1: Divination, Void Sight)
• Savant – The Nicassar Savant knows the Primaris power for both disciplines they have access to.

Options

• May Take up to 2 Additional Nicassar Savants for ‘’35 points/model’’
• A Nicassar Savant can become a “Nicassar Star-Touched”, exchanging the Divination Discipline for the Pyromancy Discipline for ’’free’’
• A Nicassar Savant can become a “Nicassar Mind-Touched”, exchanging the Divination Discipline for the Telepathy Discipline for ‘‘free’’
• Any Model may increase their Mastery Level to 2 for ‘’25 Points’’

I dropped the Life-Touched Savants, mostly because I didn't like the idea, but they'd just have the Biomancy Discipline as their "X" Discipline, and this will allow us to drop Divination from the general units, while giving the Nicassar some more psychic flexibility; what do you guys think? The Greater Meh (talk) 23:08, 15 July 2015 (UTC)

I think you also forgot a couple of thoughts on this. One of which is the Nicassar take care of their own, if they fall to chaos they get rid of the one who fell. Since they are rarely on the ground and mostly stay in space this lets them keep what comes out of the dhow very isolated. Theory 1 is also good because we already know the etherals strive to keep the nicassar from the Imperials so it could be thought that also makes them isolated in that regard.

On the subject do I like this unit? Not really, the manipulating the void kind of seems a bit odd considering the other two races that don't really manipulate the warp have something equivalent of a godlike energy that aids them, such as gork and/or mork and the hive mind. I don't know I just don't care for the fluff along with not wanting to give too much psyker support to the tau as that is one of their sticks of not having all the psyker stuff but having kick ass tech. I mean we have some anti psyker stuff with the tarrallians and N'deemi, two actual psykers with the Ranghon and Nicassars, both of whom are decent in their role. So no not really feeling this lore and unitDragoon508 (talk) 20:44, 16 July 2015 (UTC)

Tarellions

Had an idea for a unit that I wanted to run by first before I added it in.

Tarellian Nah'Rak Lizard Riders: Elite choice

Name	WS	BS	S	T	W	I	A	Ld	Sv
Tarellian Rider	3	4	3	3	2	4	2	8	4+
Tarellian Rider Master	3	4	3	3	3	4	3	9	4+

Unit Composition: 4 Rider's, 1 Rider Master

Unit Type: Calvary (Rider Master is a Character)

Wargear: Tarellian Hide Armour, Tarellian Horn Lance, Tarellian Disruption Rifle, Tarellian Fang Dagger

Options:

• May Take 5 aditional Riders for
• May take EMP Grenades for 3pts/model
• Any model can upgrade their Tarellian Fang Dagger to have the poisoned (4+) special Rule 4pts/model
• Rider master may exchange his Fang Dagger for a Claw Sword for 10pts
• A Rider Master may upgrade his Tarellian Claw Sword to have the poisoned (4+) special rule 4pts

Special Rules:

Hunting lizards are not as quick as mounts of other races and do not gain the benefits of the Fleet special rule. However their tough hide helps protect the rider and improves their saving throw by 1.

Pretty basic concept for a calvary force for the Tarellian's. dragoon508

It's good, maybe add in an option to give "Climbing Lizards" (Giant Geckos or Cliff Lizards, which sounds better?), that give in the "Move Through Cover" USR as an upgrade, although they'd be fairly expensive as Cover is fairly Detrimental to Cavalry (10 Points/Model?), and the Rider Master should have the option of a Dragon Lance in exchange for his Horn Lance. Lastly I'd Swap the BS and WS, the only "good" shooter's in the Tarellian list are the Sand Stalkers, and they've trained specifically to be able to shoot like that. Groggarioth

I think we are starting to make the Tarellians a mixture of Lizardman sarus, Dune, and Mad Max now. It is inadvertently becoming even more awesome.Dragoon508 (talk) 23:38, 10 March 2015 (UTC)

Add in Kroxigor's for the Thunder Walkers, and maybe even Ripperdactyl Riders, for a potential Flyer unit, and we've got solid flavour, all I need to do is make up their history, couple of pages should be good Groggarioth (talk) 23:48, 10 March 2015 (UK)

Tarellian Skinks?

Yeah, I'll be the first to admit that the Tarellians are basically Lizardmen IN SPACE, but I wanted to take them away from the Swamps and Aztec setting when I brewed up the units, they're still lacking a Skink equivalent though, I was thinking of making "Pup Soldiers" a smaller species of Tarellians who act as mechanics, engineers, and Builders. They'd be low cost, low Stats, (WS2, BS3, S2, T2, Ld6, SV5+) sort of thing, but more blobish, and have the Small rule (they count as 1/2 a transport space), what do you think? Groggarioth March 10 00:09 (UK)

I think I remember reading somewhere there were already a skink equivalent in the 40k verse. However I would keep them seperate and keep what you got with the Tarellian's already to be honestDragoon508 (talk) 00:20, 10 March 2015 (UTC)

Disruption Lancet Cannon Tank Weapon

Am working on a "Light" Vehicle for the Tarellian's Heavy Support slots, and had the idea to use this as a weapon

Tarellian Disruption Lancet

• Tarellian Disruption Lancet, Anti-Tank Profile (Range 24”, S:7, AP3, Heavy 1, Lance)
• Tarellian Disruption Lancet, Sky Hunter Profile (Range 36”, S:6, AP4, Heavy 3, Sky-Fire, Lance)
• Tarellian Disruption Lancet, Ground Sweeper Profile (Range 24”, S:8, AP4, Heavy 1, Beam, Gets Hot!)

Using the theme of focused Microwave Radiation, the Lancet is mounted on the tail-bed, of a repurposed Sand Junker, known as the Sand Crawler due to its low profile, and slow gait. It consists of a large multi-celled battery connected to a constructive-resonance disruption chamber, which focuses the Microwave Radiation beam into an adjustable E-M Radiation dish, that can be set in one of 3 Resonance patterns, allowing the weapon to either flood the insides of a vehicle with Microwaves, cover the the sky in a destructive flare of Radiation, or Focus a beam of Highly concentrated energy that can pierce through multiple infantry units that sweeps through the battlefield with no regard for friend or foe. Groggarioth (talk) 00:04, 11 March 2015 (UK)

You may want to have it where it has to be out of battle for the Tarellian engineers to reconfigure it to a different profile. It honestly seems way to useful if you can just make it into an allcomers list as it is. Maybe you can put it into a squadron and have each one use a different setting possibly?Dragoon508 (talk) 04:29, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Believe it or not, I do have a Set-up rule written up for a different homebrew unit (A modified XV 104, designed as mobile artillery)

Set-Up - A Unit with this rule may sacrifice it's Move phase, Psychic Phase, Shooting Phase, and Assault Phase in order to switch profiles. (This one's for the XV-10-8 Tempest BARRAGE Suit), could modify it for the Lancet, how about Reconfigure - A Unit with this rule may roll a D6 at the beginning of it's movement phase, on 3+ the unit may sacrifice its movement phase and switch weapon profiles, on a 2- it acts as normal. Groggarioth (talk) 19:48, 11 March 2015 (UK)

Yea that works out a bit better. Dragoon508 (talk) 23:15, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

Tarellian Paymaster

So, with the idea of the a specific Mercenary leader from the Allied Matrix, I present the Tarellian Paymaster.

Yea this is sort of what I was thinking of when I was mulling over the idea. A thought is that a paymaster could take other races weapons similar to how kroot mercs work, so you could have a choppa or if the Eldar pay for something he could have a shuriken catapult.

Made some edits, so I included a Pistol Weapon, and the rule Sidearm which allows them to exchange it for any pistol weapon found in their allies codex

Tarellian Paymaster (HQ, Infantry, 70 Points)

The oldest, and most experienced of the Tarellian Dog Soldiers are sometimes elevated to this position by a Desert Priest, responsible for securing contracts with the many species of the Galaxy, and negotiating the terms of these contracts, these Dog Soldiers are known as the “Paymasters” to the rest of the group that they oversee.

Famous for their ability to negotiate terms of payment with even the most hard headed of employers, the Paymasters often benefit from their position by securing copies of their employers weaponry and armour, including some rare and valuable pieces that are passed down from paymaster to paymaster. Groggarioth (talk) 17:50, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

Tarellian Paymaster (Infantry, Independent Character)

 WS | BS | S | T | W | I | A | Ld | Sv
  5 |  4 | 3 | 3 | 2 | 4 | 3 | 10 |4+/5++

Wargear

• Tarellian Disruption Rifle (Range 18”, S4, AP6, Assault 2)
• Tarellian Disruption Pistol (Range 8", S:4, AP6, Pistol 2)
• Tarellian Stalker Armour (Armour 4+, Stealth)
• Tarellian Claw Sword (Melee, S:+2, AP4, Master Crafted)
• Personal Shield Generator (Invulnerable Save 5++)

Special Rules

• Hatred (Forces of the Imperium, Tyranids)
• Preferred Enemy (Forces of the Imperium, Tyranids)
• Furious Charge
• Fearless
• Independent Character
• Forward Payment – A Tarellian Paymaster must be attached to any Tarellian force that is an allied detachment to any force other than the Tau Empire, the Paymaster may make use of any signature piece of Wargear from their allies codex, except for items from the Astra Miltarum, Space Marines, Sisters of Battle, & Tyranids Codex’s.
• Sidearm - A Tarrellian Paymaster may exchange his Disruption Pistol, for any any other pistol type weapon found in their allies codex (excluding Codex Astra Militarum, Spaces Marines, Sisters of Battle, and Tyranids)

Tarellian Sand Shrikes

So unless anyone has any really good ideas, I think this is the last unit that we should put into the Tarellian section, what do you guys think of this? The Greater Meh (talk) 17:44, 30 March 2015 (UTC)

Tarellian Sand-Shrike Riders (Fast-Attack, Flying Monstrous Creature Cavalry, 210 points, unit composition 3 Sand Shrike Riders)

Very few species native to the Tarellian’s colony planets survived both the Imperium’s Virus Bomb, and the Tyranid invasion, and the few species which did survive have been kept off of the battlefield in order to breed new stock for the Tarellian beast masters.

Of these species the Saras-Erasla, Red-Winged Desert Plateau Shrike came remarkably close to extinction, only kept alive by the sheer persistence of their breeders and riders during the evacuation, at a huge cost, in both Tarellians, Sand-Shrikes, and Tau equipment.

However, the cost has been worth it, as since the Tarellians re-location to several planets in the Tau Septs, the Sand Shrike has returned to sustainable, if not excessive numbers, allowing the Tarellians some measure of Aerial presence, which can often prove to be invaluable in their conflicts.

The Red-Winged Desert Plateau Shrike, or Red Sand-Shrike, resembles a winged Kroot Knarloc, with Dark Brown mottled scales, scarlet wing membranes, and a wickedly curved beak that it uses to tear apart its meals, earning it, and its riders, the nickname “The Butchers of the Desert”.

Tarellian Sand Shrike Rider (Flying Monstrous Creature)

 WS | BS | S | T | W | I | A | Ld | Sv
  4 |  2 | 4 | 5 | 2 | 4 | 2 |  7 | 4+

Tarellian Sand Shrike Master (Character, Flying Monstrous Creature)

 WS | BS | S | T | W | I | A | Ld | Sv
  4 |  2 | 4 | 5 | 2 | 4 | 3 |  9 | 4+

Wargear

• Tarellian Disruption Rifle (Range 18”, S4, AP6, Assault 2)
• Tarellian Horn Lance (Melee, S+1/User, AP3/4)
• Tarellian Hide Armour (Armour 5+)
• Sand Shrike Mount (Increases Armour by +1)

Special Rules

• Preferred Enemy (Forces of the Imperium, Tyranids)
• Hatred (Forces of the Imperium, Tyranids)
• Outflank
• Furious Charge
• Vector Dancer
• Acute Senses (Master Only)
• Skilled Rider (Master Only)

Options

• May take up to 2 additional Sand Shrike Riders (70 Points/Model)
• 1 Sand Shrike Rider may take a positional relay (5 points)
• 1 Sand Shrike Rider may be upgraded to Sand Shrike Master (15 Points)
• The Sand Shrike Master may exchange his Horn Lance for a Dragon Lance (Melee, S+2/user, AP3/4, Master Crafted) (5 points)

Sand Stalker Alterations

Am thinking about altering Sand Stalker's and Sand Master's (or even the entire Tarellian army) so that they can choose between either being specialised at fighting Imperium, or Tyranids, with 2 pieces of mutually Exclusive gear which are as follows.

Synapse Breaker A Unit of Sand Stalkers with this piece of wargear lose the Preferred Enemy & Hatred (Forces of the Imperium) USRs, but when they inflict a wound against a Tyranid creature with the Synapse special rule they reduce the creatures Synapse Radius by 6"

Vox Disruptor A unit of Sand Stalkers with this piece of Wargear lose the Preferred Enemy & Hatred (Tyranids) USRs, but when they inflict a wound against an Imperium unit with the orders special rule, that unit suffers a -2 to its Ld for the purposes of issuing orders.

The other option is to allow Sand Stalkers to choose between Execution Confirmed or Synapse Breakers

What do you guys think? The Greater Meh (talk) 14:20, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

Demiurge

Demiurge Ion weapons

This was the orginal profile of a ion weapon that I changed to a pulse weapon.

Name	Range	S	AP	type
Ion Caster	24"	3	4	Rapid Fire, Melta

The problem I saw with this is the new ion rules in that you can overcharge them. Not sure if a troop choice should have a weapon they can overcharge for a small blast. But this is what I had in mind if this would be balanced

Name	Range	S	AP	type
Ion Caster	24"	3	4	Rapid Fire, Melta
Ion Caster(overcharge)	24"	5	3	Blast, Gets Hot!

I cannot help but thing rolling like 10 (or probably more) to pen rolls with melta rule would be a pain in the ass to do, slowing the game considerably. Maybe you should change it to have two profiles - one for anty-infantry "dispersed" mode with a current one but without melta and one for anti-armour like Heavy 1 S7 AP3 range 12 Mezmerro (talk) 22:34, 1 March 2015 (UTC)

Name	Range	S	AP	type
Ion Caster (Dispersed)	24"	3	4	Rapid Fire
Ion Caster(Focused)	12"	7	3	Melta, Gets Hot!

So something like this then? An idea is to give the Dispersed mode blast as well. It would take out blob forces pretty well.

Rapidfiring blasts? I tried that with the Legion Veterans. It took me like five minutes to resolve their shooting, so fuck that. For shots fired en masse I'd rather go with extra hit generation, tesla/volkite style. Maybe something like misses with 1 sets the ground/cover they're hiding behind on fire, dealing 2 S2 AP5 Ignores cover hits.

Name	Range	S	AP	type
Ion Caster (Dispersed)	24"	3	4	Rapid Fire,Deflagrate
Ion Caster(Focused)	12"	7	3	Melta, Gets Hot!

This would be it if we did the Volkite style. The strength is not so high and can't rape MEQ's but it could screw over blob armies. Do you think this is balanced then?

DOOOOOOOOOOOM TRAIN!!!

Should we add an ion dampener as standard equipment for Demiurge Vehicles? To represent their systems being better able to handle the reactions?Dragoon508 (talk) 04:19, 28 June 2015 (UTC)

Demiurge Super Heavy?

Would the Demiurge have a good Super-Heavy tank, something real heavy like a 14,14,12, Multiple Ion Accelerators, maybe an Ion Devastator (Range 72", S:10, AP2, Heavy 3, Blast, Armourbane) sort of thing?

Would be interesting although with the ion weapons probably need two profiles. The 72" probably needs to be toned down a bit more. Mre like 48"Dragoon508 (talk) 08:56, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

Hmmmm we may want to take a book from the Squat codex and modify one of their giant cannon like items, although if you think about it the combat locomotive may have more firepower ,along with a bigger profile than any kind of superheavy we will come up with. So we got to keep that in mind. Let me look through some stuff and if you got anything post it, we will try to come up with something. If it comes down to it we can also do 2 super heavies for them, I mean if there is a race on this list that had them it would probably be the Demiurge.Dragoon508 (talk) 00:32, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

Demiurge Mobile Mining Fort

BS | FAV | SAV | RAV | StP
 5 |  14 |  14 |  12 |  4 

Wargear

• Twin-Linked Ion Accelerator (Front Arc) (Range 72", S:7, AP2, Heavy 3) (Overcharge, range 72", S:8, AP2, Heavy 1, Gets Hot!, Large Blast)
• 4 Quad Ion Turrets (2 Right, 2 Left) (Range 30", S:7, AP4, Heavy 4) (Overcharge, Range 30", S:8, AP4, Heavy 1, Gets Hot!, Large Blast)
• Ion Dampener - May Re-Roll "Gets Hot!" results caused by overcharged Ion Weapons

Transport

36 Models or 2 Demiurge Mining Probes

Access Points (2 Front Assault Ramps)

Fire Ports (4 Front, 4 Right, 4 Left, 8 Rear)

What do you think? groggarioth (talk) 22:32, 20 March 2015 (UK)

Maybe too many fireports. I would get rid of the forward firing ports since the front of the vehicle would take up all of the front firing ports. Also needs to probably be BS 3 since that is the baseline for Demiurge units. Since they normally only have a BS of 3. Using the Baneblade as a baseline mind you.

I would also drop the transport capacity down to 30 models, count a mining probes as 15 models basically. An option to take a pintal mounted ion rifles could also work. I would also drop the ion accelerators and instead give it a twin linked long barreled ion cannons, all you have to do is give it an overcharge profile, but these things are normally put on tau mantas so would make more sense for a super heavy to have them.Dragoon508 (talk) 00:00, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

For the overcharge version of the long barreled ion cannon you could go with str 10 ap 2 heavy 3, large blast, Gets hot!Dragoon508 (talk) 01:07, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

Soooo this? (Cost somewhere in the 800's maybe?) Groggarioth (talk) 16:46, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

Demiurge Mobile Mining Fortress

BS | FAV | SAV | RAV | StP
 3 |  14 |  14 |  12 |  4 

Wargear

• Twin-Linked Long Barreled Ion Cannons (Front Arc) (Range 90", S:7, AP2, Heavy 3) (Overcharge, range 90", S:10, AP2, Heavy 3, Gets Hot!, Large Blast)
• 4 Quad Ion Turrets (2 Right, 2 Left) (Range 30", S:7, AP4, Heavy 4) (Overcharge, Range 30", S:8, AP4, Heavy 1, Gets Hot!, Large Blast)
• Ion Dampener - May Re-Roll "Gets Hot!" results caused by overcharged Ion Weapons

Transport

30 Models or 2 Demiurge Mining Probes

Access Points (2 Front Assault Ramps)

Fire Ports (4 Right, 4 Left, 8 Rear)

Options

• May take up to 2 Sponson Mounted Twin-Linked Ion rifles on the left and right sides, and up to 4 on the rear facing (25 points each)

Demiurge artillery unit

I got an idea for a basic artillery unit but I want to get opinions on the weapon first. Probably needs someone to come up with a good name as well for the vehicle and the weapon, I am afraid.

One thought for the overcharged version is to add another rule to it. But it does seem powerful as is.Dragoon508 (talk) 06:50, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

Name	BS	FAV	SAV	RAV	HP
Ion Artillery	3	12	10	10	3

Unit Composition:

Unit Type: Vehicle (Open Topped, Tank)

Wargear: Ion charge

Options

• May include two additional models

Special Rules:

Name	Range	S	AP	type
Ion Charge	72"	6	3	Large Blast, Ordnance 1, Barrage
Ion Charge (overcharge)	72"	10	2	Gets Hot!, Large Blast, Ordnance 1. Barrage

This weapon works by putting charged ion particles into a magnetized field. Lobbing them through the air until they make contact that disrupts the field causing the charged ions to explode out

Demiurge Bombardier, Ion Annihilator? Groggarioth talk 18:12 Mar 19 (UK)

Models?

Mantic does some really nice models of the "Forge Fathers" which would be more like Squats, but they've got one that would be perfect for the Demiurge Iron Brother, I'll stick a link in here [9] The Greater Meh (talk) 18:58, 30 March 2015 (UTC)

I was actually using the Forge Fathers as a bit of insperation for some of the units to be honest. Dragoon508 (talk) 08:31, 17 June 2015 (UTC)

Demiurge units and what is needed

So besides a flyer to fill the fast attack slot with, I think I have added all that I can on the Demiurge, with a possible other HQ option but not sure there.

Currently I see two playstyles with the design/tactics fluff. You have the armored fist style with ironbreaker tanks leading the charge, especially since they are a fast vehicle. Supporting that is the steelclad heavy tanks bringing up the next row. Behind that you would have the war locomotives which work best by going sideways into a sort of gunline, this will also have the infantry to grab objectives. The back would be filled with the bombardiers to soften up the opponents. Mining probes can appear in the middle of a formation with their deep strikes or be effective in a city fight area where they can just have their frontside as the only place they can get hit.

Infantry wise you got an anti horde mode with the ion casters and a anti tank role. Troops would be supported in their advance by the iron brothers. This force would not be very mobile but are good at cover camping as they have decent armor on all the units.

Anyone think of anything besides what I mentioned at the top, relics, and warlord traits are needed? Formations will happen most likely at the end of tuning everything there is also the fact not really sure how to go about that. All of this needs playtesting still as well.Dragoon508 (talk) 13:35, 6 July 2015 (UTC)

Moving the Ironbrother

Should I move the Ironbrother unit to the elite slot instead of the heavy support slot? As it stands now the heavy support slot is extremely filled up in the Demiurge?Dragoon508 (talk) 03:10, 16 August 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, that sounds like a good idea, maybe give it a Veterancy option (Forged Iron Brother, more Attacks, or better WS/BS), or a Heavy Option (Steel Brother Suit, boosted AV's), I might switch the Battleragers to Troops at the same time The Greater Meh (talk) 16:40, 17 August 2015 (UTC)

I would keep the battleragers as an elite choice to be honest. Don't want to spam them as they are going to be great against hordes. For the other kind of iron brothers there is the posibility of reducing some stats and just giving them more armor as standardDragoon508 (talk) 01:31, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

Honor guard

I think they need a possible price increase. They are 18 points a model right now, while being able to be TEQs. So I was thinking pushing them up to 25 points a model but wanted to ask first what everyone thinks are a good price for themDragoon508 (talk) 21:48, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

Heavy Support: Brotherhood Miners - 240 points

Mining crew pressed into service for the brotherhoods.

Lorem Ipsum Dolor Sit Amet

Lorem Ipsum Dolor Sit Amet

Name	WS	BS	S	T	W	I	A	Ld	Sv
Miner	3	3	3	4	1	2	1	8	4+
Shift Leader	4	3	3	4	1	2	2	9	4+

Unit Composition: 5 Miners, 1 Shift Leader

Unit Type: Infantry (Shift Leader is Character)

Wargear: Ion Caster, Plasma Cutter, Carapace armor, Melta Bombs

Options:

• May include up to 4 additional Miners for 40 points/model

Special Rules: Grudge, Slow and Purposeful, Stubborn

This is here in case we want to rework them to be added in at another time

Giving help

The Heavy editing coming warning is there already for some time on the demigurge do you guys need help on a specific field? Fixing inconsitensies, Lore, playtesting, new ideas, balancing, just a complete rerewit? Would realy love to help out. I am going to play a game withe the dimigurg tomorow, if you guys want my to try out something specific pleas let my know. I do have time to work on things before hand so again let my know if you guys need help. BibiFloris (talk) 20:31, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

I'd planned to move over a bunch of the more Demiurg thematic stuff from the Codex: Squats, but time, work, and points costing have basically kept me from it.

Also, no Graviton rule on the Gravitic Impellar/Impulsor, that's what Grounding is for. The Greater Meh (talk) 21:38, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Is that a no damage profile? Also there is something weird with the exo armour it states it gives a 2+ but every body with the option has a 3+ And the iron brother has a 10 pts weapon that can be upgraded to a 15pts weapon for 10 pts that is weird in my opinion. BibiFloris (talk) 21:49, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Hence the need for heavy editing. Also the Gravitic Weapons are supossed to hold an enemy unit down while the rest of teh squad pepper them with heavy fire, Grounding forces a unit to Go to Ground, and then the Mass Driver profiles Ignore Cover and Rend. The weapon has to be used carefully, with different models in the unit firing different profiles. According to the Squat Playtests, it works like a dream The Greater Meh (talk) 22:12, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Is it ok that I go write some proposed changes down here or do you want to do that yourself? And already fix a few of those number bugs? BibiFloris (talk) 22:24, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

Go for it The Greater Meh (talk) 22:27, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

I will start doing that when I have access​ to my pc (I am now working from my tablet) BibiFloris (talk) 22:31, 5 April 2017 (UTC)

I have worked on a few things now for the demigurge and what is problematic with creating/assinging weapons is: that it there are only ion weapons look at the first 4 ion weapons in the tau book and the are all almost the same. IS there maby a diffrent type we can use to have more varaetie in the weapons of the dimigurge? BibiFloris (talk) 08:07, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

I have added two new weapon types to the demigurge armory I am planning on using these on the diffent models one of the tings i found in my test game having only ion weapons is boring try playing tau with only pulse or imperium with only laser. You just need the varation BibiFloris (talk) 21:48, 7 April 2017 (UTC)

This idea came up to my to add a new special weapon type to the demigurge. These weapons are meant to only be used by HQ's and unit champions, here is a first draft of the weapons. (the blaster is meant to by put onto a tank or other heavy arilary peace

Tecno arcana

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." Arthur C. Clarke

The Dimgurge use advanced tenologie that even the tau do not undersntand (partly becaus the dimigurge do not allow the tau to have a look at them) they seem to fire a nano bot and or swarm of them to fullfil a funcion. (this is speculation becaus the eartcast are not alloyw to look at these weapons and even the firecast howe fights alongside them do not realy know what the weapons look like or how the work.)

Name	Range	S	AP	type
Tecno arcana pistol	18"	-	-	Pistol, Technomancy
Tecno arcana rifle	24"	-	-	Rapid Fire, Technomancy
Tecno arcana Blaster	48"	-	-	Ordance 3, Blast, Technomancy

• Technomancy: When you fire a weapon withe this abilaty before rolling for to hit chois a ability from the next list if the shot is a hit apply the affect after the complete unit finises firing this last until the controlings player next turn.

* -1 armour save
* -2 cover save
* soulfire

BibiFloris (talk) 20:39, 11 April 2017 (UTC)

Iron Brother

In the lore for the iron borther you have written that is is not as sturdy as a dreadnougt but it still has the same armour rating for the same points cost. My idea is to have two walkers in the demigurge one elite that is a more like a dreadnougt (or what stands now withe a bit more heavy weapons) and one troop one that is just a 10 10 10 walker and some light weapons. The elite version could also them have options for the rock weapons. BibiFloris (talk) 07:11, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

In the lore for Space Marines they are capable of Spitting Acid, and gaining the knowledge of their fallen foes by eating their brains, Tau are more accurate than the Imperial guard by a good chunk, Hammerheads routinely outrange the Battle Cannons of Leman Russes. Just saying fluff and crunch don't actually match up all that often The Greater Meh (talk) 17:09, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

Isn't it desirable for fluff/crunch to fit together? Beyond when you might want to call it propaganda? Who would say that the Iron Brother is less durable than Dreadnoughts when that isn't the case in the crunch? Is it Imperial propaganda, or just Tau Auxiliary belief twisted by Imperial propaganda? Or do you think the crunch of the Dreadnought is too weak (like it should be worth 200+ pts) to be a hero among heroes? Angry Pirate (talk) 20:36, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

This is where most game designers fall short. The Fluff should NEVER contradict the Crunch. As part of core game design, the Crunch should always be designed first with balance and usability in mind, and the fluff must be designed only afterwards to support said crunch. It would be completely fucking retarded for me to describe something like say, "The Knights Inductor always go to battle in 24-man squads", and then have the crunch setup in such a way so that doing so is the most retarded thing in the entire world for you to do, and is totally non-viable. Evil Executive, CEO of Evil Incorporated (talk) 21:21, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

If the Iron-Brothers are on-par with Dreadnoughts, make them out to be like this in the fluff. You must never sacrifice gameplay functions just to appease shitty fluff. Evil Executive, CEO of Evil Incorporated (talk) 21:21, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

Okay, I'm not the one who wrote the unit or the fluff, but one thing springs out at me. Dreadnoughts are designed to work for dozens of years at a time on the offchance that some poor Space Marine gets stuck on a hostile planet, building new chassis's, replacement parts, and other things is a major ball-ache. On the other hand Iron Brothers are refitted heavy mining suits, they might go 2 months without maintenance, and will be regularly replaced. Both can bring the same amount of hurt, and take the punishment in a short battle. The Iron Brother however are not designed to just continue when they take major structural damage in the same way that a Dreadnought is. It's like retrofitting a shortbus with bulletproofed glass, strengthened chassis, and armour plates, compared to a Military Humvee. The Humvee was designed from the ground up for its purpose, the bus was not, parts of the bus will just wear out while it pulls Humvee duty. And now I'm picturing "The Magic Schoolbus Goes to WWII" The Greater Meh (talk) 22:39, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

What I have done is make the iron brother a small suit more akin to a crisis suit in walker form and have a second walker (mining suit) that has the dreadnougt clase armour so I took fluff into consideration when naming / disining these moddels. BibiFloris (talk) 21:22, 7 April 2017 (UTC)

Ranghon

So got a psyker power sheet up for the Boreal shaman but not sure what the last two powers should be. I may have some idea's later on but will take suggestions on this-dragoon508

Icy Grasp, might be a good name for "The Chill"

Ranghon may need to lose infiltrate across the board with the execption of the woodwraiths. As it stands now they are simply better versions of the Kroot, The only thing that the kroot have going for them in the tau codex is that they can basically be a platoon for one troop choice. The kroot rifle only has the rapid fire and sniper rounds over the bowcaster, which has assault better str and ap4. The kroot gun is a bit longer ranged though. What may be a better option is to replace infiltrate with scout. While not as good nor letting them outflank it would let them deploy closer for alpha strike.Dragoon508 (talk) 20:24, 7 July 2015 (UTC)

The problem with this though is that units that scout cannot assault on turn 1, so if you scout Ranghon then they can't make the use of their assault capability. And they don't have the durability to Weather a turn of shooting as testing has shown, so Infiltrate is the best option for them in that case. Unless we were to make the Spider Transport an Assault Tansport for an additional 15 points base.Evilexecutive (talk) 21:15, 7 July 2015 (UTC)

Doing the assault transport may be the best option then, as the sisters of ash plus your lord are the only real dedicated melee unit. An option is to also increase their armor save to 3 with models with ancestor armor having a 2+ save and 6++ invul save. Would make them more survivable while making them almost MEQs across the board. Add this in with scout and the assualt transport may be the way to go. Kroot would still have infiltrate and be a lot cheaper points wise plus sniper. I am just not wanting to invalidate bringing Kroot or another unit with an entire race as the ranghon have suddenly became.Dragoon508 (talk) 21:25, 7 July 2015 (UTC)

Tree Kin Walker

So thoughts on possibly making the tree kin walker a fast walker?

Anthrazods

Points Cost

Alright, this is a neat idea. But can someone please fix the points values? An old skin, with stats similar to a carnifex, is only 50 points. I'm interested in using this codex for scenarios, and don't know enough to fix this myself.

Upped the point value to 120 pts. Should be a bit more in line for what it can do. All of these rules are pretty much a work in progress and as far as I know nothing has been play tested so there will be changes to them. Thank you for pointing that out though and let us know how the game turns out. -dragoon508

Issues with Anthrazods

The painted ones don't need a CCW, they naturally punch at AP2 because smash. Also the only unit of the race I could see playing. As a literal distraction carnifex.

took that out so should solve your problem with what they have. I actually found the shock troopers pretty fun when I did their playtest. The added bonus of being able to take some of the heavier tau weapons make them pretty potent as they close to melee range. Issue I may have is basically need to think of what to add to the old skin to make it a bit better. Maybe add some stuff for when it is in a unit.Dragoon508 (talk) 03:29, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

Thraxians

Groggarioth Okay so, I've been working on the Thraxians, and this is what I've got so far.

• Insectoid Species, with lots of sub-species, and genetic sub-orders, represented by Phenotypes
• Very few actual units, A Basic Worker Brood, A Basic Warrior Brood, and I'm still working on a HQ, called "Colony Master" for now
• Outside of those, there'll be a couple of specialised units that use one or 2 different phenotypes depending on how you want to build them

I'm just putting the Phenotype list, and the warrior unit up for some feedback before I continue, 'cause I'm butting my head up against a brick wall every time I try to think of how to actually make the HQ, and how to cost the Phenotypes

Should be up in the next few days Groggarioth

I honestly think that sticking to a broad Ant Phenotype may be best. Can do worker, Warrior, Drone, Queen. Sorta like the Formians from DnD/Pathfidner [10].

The reason for this is that it matchs the picture I found a bit and can give you a good basis for units. Just a suggestion on this portion Dragoon508 (talk) 00:59, 7 March 2015 (UTC)

2 Days ago I'd have agreed with you, but I managed to make some pretty good progress, as it stands, I'm gonna drop the "Roach" Phenotype, but I've managed to think of a good unit for each other Phenotype, alongside Special Characters for the Dragonfly and Beetle phenotypes. Groggarioth March 7th, 01:47 2015 UK Time

Well looking forward to it then. I would also drop the Moth phenotype as well if only because we seem to have a lot of poison floating around in the codex. I think we have some of the Ranghon units, A Morellian weapon, The Tarellions can take a lot of poison, a couple vespid weapons, and a Galg Weapon. We may be using this weapon type a bit too much. However that is my only real reason to drop it since we have a lot, although since this is a insect race it makes sense. Well all the races that have the poison rule for weapons make some sense, just may be a bit too prevelent where someone can basically make all of their units moth phenotypes for poisonDragoon508 (talk) 02:19, 7 March 2015 (UTC)

Only one issue that I can think of is the pair of Talons that the Dart Wings have. I am honestly not sure if Melee weapons can be twinlinked. I think it would just count as an additional close combat weapon. But if someone says that they can then I have no issue. Just unsure on this one is all. Dragoon508 (talk) 22:11, 7 March 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for spotting that, I forgot to remove it from when the race had "Multi-Armed" which allowed them to dual-wield Two-Handed Weapons, the Twin-Linked there was suppossed to represent the fact that they had 2 pairs of talons to fight with, without Multi-armed, there's no logical way for that Twin-Linked to exist. Also, it probably should have been Master-crafted, but how do you Master-Craft Hands?

Could say that they can equip talons on their fingers for a mastercraft version.

Phenotypes Edit 2.0

Can I please get some opinions people, this is the core of the Thraxian units and if it's shit again I need to rework it for a forth time, which quite frankly has the potential to be a massive ball-ache The Greater Meh (talk) 14:44, 23 September 2015 (UTC)

I still say we need to drop the moth phenotype due to the abundance of poison and starting to intrude onto the abilities of the vespid. I would say the same for the dragonfly and butterfly phenotypes, again for the reason that it is overlapping with vespids. For a flying phenotype you should look into making it an ant subtype with drones to be honest.Dragoon508 (talk) 16:17, 23 September 2015 (UTC)

Moth Phenotype – A model with this Phenotype has weaker chitin (Armour -1) than normal, but it gains the Jump Infantry type and the Poisoned (4+) USR on all of its attacks (If it already has the Poisoned USR on any weapon it increases by 3+, to a maximum of (2+)). (3 points/Model) (HQ grants any Moth unit it joins the Poisoned (2+) USR/25 Points)

Ant Phenotype – A model with this Phenotype has an uncanny bond with its Brood-mates, they gain +1 Ld, & always test to regroup on their unmodified leadership. (3 Point/Model) (HQ grants “And They Shall Know No Fear” USR /15 points)

Beetle Phenotype – A model with this Phenotype has tougher chitin (Armour +1) than normal and has the “Slow & Purposeful” USR, but loses 2 Initiative. (4 Points/Model) (HQ has the Relentless USR rather than “Slow & Purposeful”/20 points)

Dragonfly Phenotype – A model with this Phenotype has -2 armour & loses 1 Strength, but gains the Jet-Pack infantry type, +2 Initiative, the Fleet USR, and the “Scouts” USR. (5 Points/Model) (HQ reduces Deep Strike scatter to 1d6 rather than 2d6/20 Points)

Mantis Phenotype – A model with this Phenotype is unusually skilled at melee combat, their scythe-line claws tearing through their opponents despite their weak looking frames, -1 Strength, but gain +1 Initiative and all Melee attacks gain the Rending USR (5 Points/Model)(HQ gains the Instant Death USR/15 Points)

Butterfly Phenotype – A model with this Phenotype is often mistaken as a Psyker by the races & cultures who’ve had trouble with such reality bending individuals in the past, however their apparent powers are the result of a extremely fine neurotoxin powder that falls from their wings and interferes with their enemies perception. The model suffers -1 Armour & -1 Strength, but gains the Psychedelic Special Rule & the Jump infantry type. (5 Points/model) (HQ inflicts a -2 modifier to any Psychedelic tests/25 Points)

A Unit may only have 1 phenotype. An Independent character that joins a unit without a phenotype retains their own phenotype and grants the benefit to any model that doesn’t possess a Phenotype, However if an independant character joins a unit that already has a phenotype they retain the benefits themselves, but do not grant the bonuses to any models that already possess a different Phenotype. (Poorly written I know, but if you can figure out how to word better please do) The Greater Meh (talk) 16:52, 7 September 2015 (UTC)

Pschedelic

Psychedelic – Any enemy unit that makes a shooting attack against a model with this rule must make a leadership test, if this test is failed all shots are treated as snap shots, if a Unit is firing overwatch against this model, then they must make a leadership test, if this test is failed the unit may not fire overwatch, any model that does not have a Leadership score (Such as Vehicles) instead rolls a D6, on a 4+ it is treated as having passed the required Ld test, units with the Mark of Slaanesh take a -1 modifier to these tests as they further lose themselves to the pretty colours.

Thraxian Warrior Brood

Thraxian Warrior (Infantry)

 WS | BS | S | T | W | I | A | Ld | Sv
  4 |  3 | 4 | 4 | 3 | 3 | 3 |  8 | 5+

Thraxian Warrior Brood Leader (Infantry, Character)

 WS | BS | S | T | W | I | A | Ld | Sv
  4 |  3 | 4 | 4 | 3 | 3 | 4 |  9 | 5+

Wargear

• Burst Cannon
• 2 Power Swords (Melee, S:User, AP3, )
• Chitin (Armour 5+)
• Photon Grenades

Special Rules

• Phenotype

Options

• May take up to 4 additional Thraxian Warriors (16 points/Model)
• The Entire unit may take EMP Grenades (4 points/Model)
• One Thraxian Warrior may replace their Burst Cannon with a Fusion Blaster (10 Points)
• One Thraxian Warrior may replace their Burst Cannon with a High Yield Missile Pod (15 Points)
• One Thraxian Warrior may be upgraded to a Warrior Brood Leader (10 Points)
• The Warrior Brood Leader may Replace both his Power Swords with a Personalised Power Glaive (Melee, S:+3, AP3, Rending) (15 Points)
• The Unit may take any Phenotype for its listed cost

Thraxian Weapon Overhaul

Working on refitting the Thraxian weapons to give them some of their own flavour, along with plans for a couple of "Walkers", and a Lord of War, the "Hive Carapace Walker", so there'll be a bunch of updates there, mostly slight nerfs, and buffs, along with a couple of new units showing up. But here's a list of the weapons I've got written up so far

Edit 2.0

Infantry Weapons

Light Spine Launcher (Range 12”, S:4, AP6, Assault 3) (Moth/Dragonfly)

Spine Launchers (Range 18”, S:5, AP5, Assault 3) (Beetle/Ant)

Chitin Flak Cannon (Range 18”, S:3+(6-X), APX, Heavy 2, Armour Eater) (Moth, Ant, Beetle)

• Armour Eater: A Weapon with this Rule treats its AP as equal to its Wielders Armour Save (So a Model with 3+ armour would have AP3), and calculates its Strength by adding 3+(6-AP) so in this example it would be 3+(6-3)=S:6, however should a model wielding this weapon roll a 1 on its "to Hit" roll it permanently loses 1 point from its armour save, affecting this weapons Strength & AP.

Glamour Cannon (Range 30”, S:1, AP-, Heavy 3, Blast, Blind, Poison 5+) (Butterfly)

Bio-Pyrite Spray (Range Template, S:6, AP4, Heavy 2) (Beetle)

Bio-Pyrite Torrent Launcher (Range, Template, S:6, AP4, Heavy 2, Torrent) (Beetle)

Disk Spitter (Range 18”, S:6, AP3, Salvo 2/5, Shred) (Beetle)

Bio-Pyrite Bombard (Range 6”-36”, S:6, AP4, Heavy 1, Large Blast, Barrage) (Beetle)

Impulse Launcher (Range 24”, S:6, AP2, Heavy 1, Ignores Cover) (Beetle)

Dispersed Impulse Launcher (Range 12”, S:4, AP4, Heavy 1, Ignores Cover) (Beetle)

Electrode Motivator (Melee, S:user, AP5) (All)

Power Glaive (Melee, S:+2, AP3) (All)

Power Disk (Range 6”, S:+1, AP3, Assault 1, Melee, Shred, Returning) (Moth/Dragonfly)

Carapace Walker Weapons

Silk Weavers (Melee S:User, AP-, Strike-down)

Barbed Silk Weavers (Melee, S:user, AP5, Rending)

Heavy Chitin Flak Cannon (Range 36”, S:6, APX, Heavy 2, Skyfire)

Heavy Disk Spitter (Range 30”, S:8, AP3, Salvo 3/7, Shred)

Heavy Spine Launchers (Range 42”, S:6, AP4, Heavy 4, Pinning, Rending)

Glamour Cannon (Range 30”, S:1, AP-, Heavy 3, Blast, Blind, Poison 5+)

Impulse Cannon (Range 60”, S:8, AP2, Heavy 1, Ignores Cover)

Dispersed Impulse Cannon (Range 36”, S:6, AP4, Heavy 1, Large Blast, Ignores Cover)

Spinneret Silk Spitter (Range 12”, S:-, AP-, Assault 1d6, Binds)

• Binds: A weapon with the Binds special Rule does not inflict wounds, and ignores Armour & Invulnerable saves, but not Cover Saves. Any model hit with a Binding attack must make an Initiative test, if it passes all is well, if it fails it's WS, BS, I, and all Movements are reduced by Half, and it must make a Strength test when charged, if it fails it is unable to fire overwatch. These effects last until the end of that units next assault phase, or if they suffer a wound from any Flame weapon (Melta or Flamer type weaponry).

Hive Walker Super Weapons

Hive Spine Launchers (Range 72”, S:8, AP3, Primary Weapon 4, Pinning, Rending)

Heavy Impulse Cannon (Range 72”, S:D, AP1, Primary Weapon 1, Ignores Cover, Armourbane)

Dispersed Heavy Impulse Cannon (Range 48”, S:7, AP3, Primary Weapon 1, Apocalypse Blast (10”), Ignores Cover)

Hive Disk Spitter (Range 48”, S:9, AP2, Salvo 4/8, Shred, Rending)

The Greater Meh (talk) 15:52, 3 July 2015 (UTC)

Well first off how common are spine launchers going to be? To me they are just a better version of a pulse carbine. everything else looks decent although the heavy impulse range of 108 should probably be 72 inchs. Got to play the models to get a feel for weapons to be honest.Dragoon508 (talk) 09:39, 2 July 2015 (UTC)

The Spine Launcher are going to take the place of Burst Cannons mostly on Ant & Beetle Warriors, with Moths & Dragonfly's getting Light spine launchers to account for their greater mobility and generally weaker frames, I dropped the pinning rule, mostly as it was a space filler that didn't really need to be there, however the LSL's may change soon, most likely Range, or Assault 2 Twin-Linked. it all depends. The Greater Meh (talk) 20:29, 3 July 2015 (UTC)

Issues with Thraxians

Not even going to do a unit by unit for this one. All the units without phenotypes are already spending to many points for what they are. Then the pheontypes are expensive, and come with a massive downside. Except the ants, which are just overly expensive for something that people only take when they want crisis suits as troops.

Going to agree on probably being overcosted for what they do. Groggarioth has a habit of making things really expensive for what they do (sorry had to say it dude), but none of these guys have gotten playtests yet so we shall see.Dragoon508 (talk) 03:24, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

The truth is the truth man, when I'm costing things I just throw numbers at a wall and hope I get it right, as for the Thraxians themselves I was happy with them when I first finished them, but now, they are complete shit, I'm trying to redo them but it's not too fun, as it stands, take them out of the Codex for now, and I'll redo them in their entirety although it may take a while. The Greater Meh (talk) 16:29, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

Alright I will slap a currently being reworked warning on the top of the thraxian stuff, that way we can still refer to what we have as you work on it.Dragoon508 (talk) 17:53, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

Gue'Vesa

apparent failure of the dex

(transferred to right place) You're failing, your entire gue'vesa section is broken AF. Why would I bring fire warriors when I now have these guys who shoot just as well as firewarriors with weapons that are just as good as firewarrior's but are better at melee AND ARE CHEAPER. This is so broken, tau players might use CAD again just so that they can bring this stuff.

I have to ask what part does the gue'vesa basic troops do better than fire warriors? They have lasguns still along with flak armor. Fire warriors have more men, better weapons, and better armor still. They also can do supporting fireDragoon508 (talk) 06:27, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

I suppose he may be referring to the Pulse Carbine upgrade. But honestly, Firewarriors suck, they get outgunned by SMs. SMs have ATSKNF and are far better in CC and still win at range. It really isn´t a problem of the fandex maker that the thing his fandex is being made to support is internally unbalanced. The only thing that makes fire warriors somewhat worthwhile nowadays is their formation. No matter how you put it Fire Warriors are a tax to get all the cool mechs. If Tau Auxiliary doesn´t have any OP mechs (which it doesn´t) then Gue´Vesa don´t have to be a tax like the Fire Warriors are. Angry Pirate (talk) 08:57, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Points Cost

Gue'Vesa have the same statline and starting gear as guardsmen, inferior transport options and inferior special weapons, doesn't get orders, and have that horribly illogical Traitors rule (that only going to work against other guardsmen and concripts, but still), and they still cost more points. The same goes for the strike team, who cost a whooping 16 pts each, while a tactical Marine is only 13, and a Fire warrior is 9. WTF? Mezmerro (talk) 22:23, 1 March 2015 (UTC)

Good point, they should probably be a bit cheaper to be honest. I have been using the guard codex as a baseline for the costs. I think I will drop the regular Gue'Vesa down to 50 points, that way the basic gue'vesa come down to 5pts/model.

As for the strike team they also have deep strike and infiltrate. Not to mention the pulse carbines which are assault 2 and pinning weapons. I suppose dropping them down to 14pts/model could be a good move. That way they are only 1 point above tactical squads.

The Traitor rule is a holdover from their old white dwarf stats/forgeworld. Figured it should stay in there since it is sort of a legacy item -dragoon508

Orion

So Orion fought alongside Tau by Tau way, and not by human way, abandoning his own kind to bond with Shas caste. Than why does he have high WS and lot of attacks, considering Tau way of war doe's not involve a lot of close combat training?

He has the exact same WS and Attacks as a Tau Battlesuit commander. Well honestly he has the same stateline of the tau battlesuit commander. -dragoon508

Gue'Vesa Strike Team Sawfish Transport

Had an idea for a Strike Team Dedicated Transport called the "Sawfish", essentially a modified Piranha, the Strike Team hang on the side of the vehicle for quick transport and deployment.

Hmmm a good idea to be honest. I would not let it increase the transport count however. I would also think of letting the Sawfish run a fusion blaster as well. Let me look over the codex when I get home. Dragoon508 (talk) 21:37, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

Coolio, I found the original idea as a "Counts as" Valkyrie for someone making their own Gue'Vesa army for Apocalypse on the DakkaDakka Forums [[11]], thought it would make for a good unit with some re-jigging Groggarioth 23:33 8th March (UK)

Yea I also need to make the Valkyrie Pices a dedicated transport for them. But this will be a good one to have with a bit of additions and stuff.

Sawfish Strike Team Transport (Skimmer, Fast, Open-Topped)

 BS | FAV | SAV | RAV | HP
  3 |  11 |  10 |  10 |  2

Wargear

• Burst Cannon
• Shield Generator (4++ Invulnerable)

Transport Capacity - 6

Access - Right, Left

Fire Ports - None

Special Rules

• Hold Tight - Passengers cannot fire from this vehicle as they are busy holding on to their handholds..
• Quick Drop - Passengers may Disembark, and act normally even if the "Sawfish" has moved more than 6"
• Assault Vehicle

Options

• The Sawfish may increase its transport capacity to 10, but loses the Fast Vehicle Type.

Jump Sentinel

I got an idea for sentinels equiped with with jump jets that let them jump around and deep strike. However not sure how the rules would work. This is what I have so far but not sure if this works rules wise.

Basically the earth caste and humans reinforce a regular drop sentinal and add jump jets so it can jump around.

Name	WS	BS	S	FA	SA	RA	I	A	HP
Jump sentinel	3	3	5	10	10	10	3	1	2

Unit Composition: 1 Jump Sentinel

Unit Type: Vehicle (Walker, opened top, Jump Pack)

Wargear: Burst cannon

Options:

• May Replace Burst Cannon with a Fusion Blaster 10pts
• May replace burst cannon with a flamer

Special Rules: Deep Strike, Scouts, Move through covor

As far as I can tell that should be fully rules-legal, don't bank on that though I'm not an expert, might be an idea to add in a Blacksun filter (everything in the Tau list has them), and the option to add in a Twin-Linked Plasma Rifle (15 Points), rather than a Fusion Blaster, or to Twin-Link their Burst cannon (5 Points) Groggarioth March 10 00:00 (UK)

Well I don;t want to put in any twinlink on these because they are supposed to be light single weapon platforms like a Sentinel. Basically they are just repurposed with tau tech to help the Gue'Vesa Auxillares in the Hunter Cadre to fit a more mobile force. As for the fusion blaster, that is basically the replacement for the Multi melta that a sentinel can takeDragoon508 (talk) 04:31, 11 March 2015 (UTC)

New Gue'Vesa units

I got a couple of ideas for a few more Gue'Vesa units that as soon as I get the wording right I will post. I want to make another elite unit and some heavy support units since so far they are lacking those options.

The Gue'vesa super heavy will be basically the Guntank from Gundam, just got to think of how the weapons will work right now.Dragoon508 (talk) 07:53, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Got to say I like the Dogfish units a lot. Gives a good combo of tau tech and human tech which was one of the themes I was going for with the Gue'Vesa Dragoon508 (talk) 09:17, 17 June 2015 (UTC)

Plasma Rifle use

Should we keep the plasma rifle and burst rifle to units that would be strong enough to carry them? Or when they are man portable they require two people to haul it like a heavy bolter team? Because normally they are equiped on things of at least bulky size. Dragoon508 (talk) 23:33, 18 June 2015 (UTC)

Fair point, however the original Stormtroopers / Tempestus scions have the ability to grab Plasma Guns in the IG codex, and the Plasma rifle, isn't actually that much larger than the Pulse Rifle when comparing models, good fix might be giving them this statline (Strike Team Plasma Rifle, Range 24", S:6, AP2, Salvo 1/2) as the salvo will emulate Rapid Fire in a weird, inverse fashion, while still giving the feeling of being a heavy weapon, although I'd Drop the price to 12 Points in order to compensate the movement Sacrifice.

Alright put that in then.Dragoon508 (talk) 01:05, 19 June 2015 (UTC)

Gue'Vesa Heavy Weapon Teams

Would it be worth doing this? Using them as a Troops choice, with a bunch of Heavy Weapon options, Burst Cannons, Missile Pod, Heavy Rail Rifle, High-Intensity Markerlights, to name a few options The Greater Meh (talk) 16:55, 17 August 2015 (UTC)

I would say no, the gue'vesa have a ton of options right now as it stands. Maybe a new specil character but that is about it that is needed for the gue'vesaDragoon508 (talk) 17:21, 17 August 2015 (UTC)

Something like this? (EDIT 2.0 yes I suck at names, so many birds of prey for a expert soldier from the Elysian Drop Troops or Harakoni Warhawks) The Greater Meh (talk) 21:33, 17 August 2015 (UTC)

I would come up with a different first name but a callsign of redtail sounds fine. It sounds like a good upgrade troop as well for the strike teams. Although evil is pretty big on using them as a suicide squad so good old redtail may not last longDragoon508 (talk) 01:11, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

New first name, if you want to stick him into the codex, go for it The Greater Meh (talk) 15:32, 19 August 2015 (UTC)

Name	WS	BS	S	T	W	I	A	Ld	Sv
Gue'Vesa'El John 'Redtail' Mather	4	5	3	3	3	3	3	8	4+

Wargear: Osprey (Pulse Carbine with Assault 3 & Built in Networked Markerlight), Combat Armour, Frag Grenades, EMP Grenades, Blacksun Filter

Options

• This model may be taken as a replacement to a Strike Team's Gue'Vesa'Vre for 25 Points

Special Rules: Deep Strike, Traitors, Stealth, Rapid Insertion (Grants any squad he joins a +1 to reserve rolls)

Question: Are there any Space Marine Gue'vesa?

As it says on the tin, I've seen it in other places, homebrew sites, art-work, that EataTau comic, but when I asked the guys who introduced me to 40K (IG Player, Tyranid Player, SM Player) the IG player yelled at me about filthy xeno scum (He takes his role-playing seriously), the Nid player said "meh, don't care", and the Space Marine player had no idea, though did say it was incredibly unlikely seeing the way SM will go to rather extremely lengths to rescue their own. It's completely unlikely that there are enough to even qualify for a Lord of War slot so there's no point in making a unit, but this question has been gnawing at me.

For the purpose of the codex and the lore it would be extremely rare for it to happen. There may be one or two in the empire but it would not make a great lords of war choice or special character. They would probably be stuck in the empire training troops and having tests ran on them to try to replicate the gene seed. Dragoon508 (talk) 01:13, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

Agree with Dragoon508. Lorewise it is possible, to the best of my knowledge. However, it's very rare for SMs to go rogue without direct Chaotic influence (that's what all the brainwashing as they're initiated is supposed to prevent), and more importantly, the Imperium takes a particular pain to try and wipe out any SMs that go rogue, especially in numbers. The idea of SMs joining the Tau Empire is probably a source of Imperium nightmare fuel - especially since the higher ups have the brains and the information to contemplate the real possibility that the Tau might have the biological skill to understand and replicate geneseed. Which is, after all, just a "bio-borging" process; upgrading humans by implanting genetically engineered organs. If the Tau can reverse-engineer that, then they can either begin converting their Gue'vesa into Space Marines of their own, or they can create their own version of the process to create "Super Tau". With that in mind, the Imperium has got to place high priority on keeping Space Marines and geneseed out of Tau hands. 116.250.104.193 03:01, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

Lorewise I know the Tau have their hands on some Space Marine prisoners (Damocles Crusade, a Shas'o or Shas'El Monat manages to catch a "White Scars" (I think) in a suspended stasis-field as a suicide attack) so there's that, not sure but I think they're still trying to extract them from the time bubble. The Greater Meh (talk) 21:38, 2 October 2015 (UTC)

Question: Should we add some more Weapon Options to the Gue'Vesa Combat Engineers?

Exactly what it says on the tin, potential options include, a Grenade Launcher (Frag, Krak, & EMP), An Ion Rifle, maybe a Man Prtable version of the Fusion Blaster (Heavy 1 rather than Assault 1), what do you guys think?

I am not sure on the grenade launcher for emp grenades at the very least. Seems like it would wreck vehicles something fierce. The man portable fusion blaster may be a good choice along with an ion rifle. One of the things I was thinking was letting a combat engineer squad able to boost the cover save of one piece of terrain at the start of the match that is in their deployment zone, or being able to deploy a trench terrain piece at the start of the match that gives 5+ coverDragoon508 (talk) 20:57, 21 August 2015 (UTC)

Well if we keep the Grenade Launcher as Heavy 1 with a middling range (18"-24"), that might stop it from being too overpowered, because Snap Firing is not good for accuracy, the Ion Rifle we know how that works, the Fusion Blaster might be good with this profile (Range 18" S:6, AP1, Assault 1, Melta) Lowering its strength to make it more portable. The Greater Meh (talk) 23:32, 21 August 2015 (UTC)

Still not sold on the grenade launcher shooting haywire grenades off. It is going to be pretty devistating even with heavy on it. You could just stick to cover and plink a vehicle to death safely instead of getting close to take it out. The fusion blaster being man portable would work, as long as strike teams don't get it. Fluff wise it is too heavy for them to drop with it. Dragoon508 (talk) 23:36, 21 August 2015 (UTC)

So here are the options I've been playing with Frag & Krak Grenade Launcher (Frag: Range 18", S:4, AP6, Assault 1, Blast) (Krak: Range 18", S:6, AP4, Assault 1) 15 Points, Fusion Lance (Range 18", S:6, AP1, Heavy 1, Melta) 15 Points, Flak Cannon (Range 24", S:5, AP2, Heavy 1, Skyfire) 10 Points The Greater Meh (talk) 20:55, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

Voice of the Gue'vesa

Since I took out granting stubborn since it was redundant with the ability to take priests, what should the third option be for the voice of the Gue'vesa ability. So far it gives feel no pain and counter attackDragoon508 (talk) 22:11, 21 August 2015 (UTC)

Split Fire? The Greater Meh (talk) 23:36, 21 August 2015 (UTC)

That actually sounds like a good choice. Will add that inDragoon508 (talk) 23:45, 21 August 2015 (UTC)

Compressing the Russes

Can I just compress the Dogfish variants?

It'd be a Good idea, save for the fact I might've modelled them after the base Leman Russ, and the "Siege" Russ, so the RAV varies across some of them, however if you can put your hands on a Astra Militarum 'Dex PDF or physical copy, they do something different which is closer to having each Leman Russ type listed in the Stat box, each Type having their wargear listed like below, granted this makes the single entry somewhat dense, however it should help save space and maintain a decent level of neatness, what'll we do with all of the fluff I wrote up though? The Greater Meh (talk) 21:21, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

We can probably compress all the fluff into one big collapsible boxDragoon508 (talk) 22:05, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

Okay, I'll try and finish the fluff for the Fogbank tomorrow, and that should be all of the Dogfish's done for good, until we get to play-testing them The Greater Meh (talk) 22:07, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

Yea one of the plans I have is to try to playtest the dogfish and the valkyrie pices within a couple of games. I think the jump sentinel, dogfish, and the engineering teams are the only thing that have not had at least one playtest so far for the gue'vesaDragoon508 (talk) 22:14, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

That's the Fogbank's Fluff done, and all the compression done as well, however the Dogfish currently has no option to take Vehicle battle Systems, so I've put a line in with the WIP Tag so we can argue about it here The Greater Meh (talk) 15:06, 28 August 2015 (UTC) (why do I keep forgetting to Tag myself?)

Heavy Support - Dogfish

Name	BS	FAV	SAV	RAV	HP
Dogfish Tempest	3	14	13	11	3
Dogfish St Elmo	3	14	13	10	3
Dogfish Thunderhead	3	14	13	11	3
Dogfish Maelstrom	3	14	13	10	3
Dogfish Undertow	3	14	13	10	3
Dogfish Fogbank (WIP)	3	14	13	10	3

Unit Composition: 1 Dogfish

Unit Type: Vehicle (Tank, Heavy)

Wargear (all): Blacksun Filter

Wargear (Tempest): 4 Burst Cannons, Point-Defence Targeting Relay

Wargear (St Elmo): 2 St Elmo Incinerators, Hull-Mounted Burst Cannon

Wargear (Thunderhead): Thunderhead Plasma Cannon, Hull-Mounted Burst Cannon

Wargear (Maelstrom): Maelstrom Fusion Cannon, Hull-Mounted Burst Cannon

Wargear (Undertow): Undertow Ripple Cannon, Hull-Mounted Burst Cannon

Wargear (Fogbank (WIP)): 2 Fogbank Missile Pods (Range 72", S:6, AP-, Assault 6) Velocity Tracker, Early Warning Override

Options:

• May Choose one of the following Tanks

  Dogfish Tempest 150 points

  Dogfish St Elmo 130 Points

  Dogfish Thunderhead 140 Points

  Dogfish Maelstrom 160 Points

  Dogfish Undertow 150 Points

  Dogfish Fogbank (WIP) 150 Points?

• Any Dogfish that doesn't have a Hull-Mounted Weapon may Take a Hull Mounted weapon for the Following costs, if it already has a Hull-Mounted Weapon reduce the weapons cost by 10 points ---

• Heavy Flamer (10 Points)
• Burst Cannon (10 Points)
• Heavy Rail Rifle (20 Points)

• Any Dogfish may Take a Pair of Sponsons armed with ---

• Tau Plasma Rifles (30 Points)
• Burst Cannons (20 Points)
• Fusion Blasters (20 Points)
• Twin-Linked Flamers (20 Points)
• Missile Pods (30 Points)

Issues with Gue'Vesa

Gue'Vesa Combat Engineer, The mine layers rule is way overly complicated. Just use the Snare Mines from IG.

While the mine layer rules for them are complex, there is another unit that has something really similar except it is a vehicle that is an official forge world unit, the ork mine layer. Snaremines only work if you are the one being charged, you can't run around planting mines to help mess up charge lanes.Dragoon508 (talk) 03:22, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

Put them on a Sawfish, and just zoom around the table like a madman dropping mines into charge lanes. Thanks to the beauty of RAW Exploits, they can lay mines while on a Zooming Sawfish. Not sure if that's a good or a bad thing, but I for one think it's absolutely hilarious(and risky as hell), to get a 66% chance of ruining someone's charge lanes in a nice and reactive way. Evilexecutive (talk) 04:35, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

While that idea is appealing, the sawfish won't let them do that, since it prevents the units embarked on it from doing a shooting attack which laying the mines is considered.Dragoon508 (talk) 04:53, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

You might want to take a long, hard look at the Minelayer ability for the Combat Engineers. Nowhere in it does it say that it counts as a shooting attack, only that its an ability that's used in the shooting phase. Also, the Sawfish similarly only says "Passengers Cannot Fire From This Vehicle". Amusingly enough, RAW has always taken precedence over RAI, and is only not the case when an official FAQ has been released dictating that the RAI has precedence. If you want to change it, you're welcome to. Evilexecutive (talk) 05:24, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

Alright then I will go ahead and change it then. Thank you for pointing that out. Side note, should we change the snare rule for the mines to proc a pinning test instead of a dangerous terrain test?Dragoon508 (talk) 05:33, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

I honestly think you should have the mines always count as Difficult Terrain(Representing that they can considerably slow down a unit). And yea, Pinning would make the snare mine actually a lot more useful. Evilexecutive (talk) 05:40, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

Alright so mines count as difficult terrain and the snare mines cause a pinning test. Really good defensive item that will need playtests. Side note on your original idea to use a sawfish for mine laying. While you can't do it with a sawfish, you could technically do it with a sandjunker since you could take an empty one and load them up in it. Since it is opened topped it should work out.Dragoon508 (talk) 00:37, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Gue'Vesa Sniper Team, So, a long shot pulse rifle is a 48" sniper rifle with rapid fire. I don't see any possible reason you would take the Gue'Vesa troopers over snipers in mass quantity. You already want to do a double or triple detatchment due to the amount of good cheap units in the codex.

Probably need a point's increase then. Especially because their equipment is pretty good. I was thinking of making them more along the cost of how the current sniper drones are right now at around 55 points for a team, as the sniper drones are 58 points a team.Dragoon508 (talk) 03:22, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

You just gotta ask yourself, because the GEQ statline is only a whopping 5 points in value. And camo-CLOCKS are only 1 point more. So is the Longshot Pulse Rifle really worth 2 points? Probably not, and that needs to be corrected. I'd boost their cost to 11 points.Evilexecutive (talk) 04:35, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

May want to boost that to 12 or 13 points a model, a tau sniper drone is 15 points a model. We may also want to put a cap on how many you can take so they can't be spammed.Dragoon508 (talk) 04:49, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

Valkyrie Pisces, wow this is shit. Like... the grav shoot insertion is great and all... but unlike heavy bolters, burst cannons are not really good on a flyer.

Well besides a shorter range and not being ap 4, a burst canon is pretty good with one more shot. However we could also swap the burst canons out for long barreled burst canons, which are not ap4 but have the same range as a heavy bolter and can fire 6 shots. You are forgetting the ability to take systems from the tau codex like the disruption pod which would give them a 6+ cover save no matter what, or other things. The seeker missiles are also useful along with the gun drones being able to pin down troops.Dragoon508 (talk) 03:22, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

Jump Sentinel, This is sort of random. Like I could see a jet sentinel. Kinda.

They are basically just fun little units with a bit more maneuverability than an IG drop sentinel with the jump shoot jump tactic. Plus they can deep strike so that is a useful tactic with them.Dragoon508 (talk) 03:22, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

Dogfish Medium Battle Tank, only the Fogbank does something I couldn't really get elsewhere in the codex for a better price.

Going to have to agree too disagree here. They look fine to me as a tank option, while demiurge may have better tanks, these look fine as well. Maybe add the option to make them a tank commander and the ability to squardren up.Dragoon508 (talk) 03:22, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

Morrallian

Couple of things I have noticed as I am looking through these. The Grim has leadership 10 so probably want to drop this down to 9. Just is not an HQ unit. Other issue is the longshot Rail Rifle that the Returned have. The earth caste still has trouble making them long ranged so suddenly the Morrallian's suddenly are able to make such an item is something that probably should not happen. So put it down as a regular rail rifle. Last issue is this. Does the Dullahan’s Carriage have fire ports? And where is the access ramps? Dragoon508 (talk) 07:11, 6 March 2015 (UTC)

I think that's everything addressed, Added the Access point on the "Dullahan" to be a rear ramp, with Fire Port's on the left and right. Dropped the Ld on the Grim down to 9, and removed the Longshot Rail Rifle from the "Returned", I took it from another Homebrew unit the XV-2-578 Darkfire Assassin Suit which should be on Battlesuit. Replaced it with the option to take Rail Rifles, and Ion Rifles.

Found an image of the C&C 3 TW, KW, unit that I based the Morrallian Raven Gunship on, can't figure out how to insert the image though http://cnc.wikia.com/wiki/File:Command_and_conquer_3_kanes_wrath_conceptart_eiQ7b.jpg Groggarioth

Got it up for you. You need to upload the image to the wiki first then do some html magic

thanks

Looks like you got to go through the morellians again and re add the immunity stuff to most of the units. Looks like they lost some of it when it got reformatedDragoon508 (talk) 00:27, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

Just noticed this as well on the morrallians. The rail pistol probably should be dropped because fluff wise the rail rifle is as small as a rail weapon can be made right now.

Removed Rail pistol, replaced it with a normal Pulse Pistol, and dropped Haze Walker's cost to compensate.

So looking over the Morrallian's a bit more, and they need to get their cost dropped across the board. As it stands now they are simply too expensive. They are running up at space marine prices for units.Dragoon508 (talk) 00:19, 27 June 2015 (UTC)

Anomaly Missile

1: It´s extremely cheap, you might as well include it in the wargear of the ship and increase the ships cost by 25 pts. 2: It´s unnecessarily complicated and its rule doesn´t make sense, if 3 units of 5 Necron Warriors stand next to each other then it makes 5 shots, if the 15 warriors are combined into one unit ten it makes 15 shots. It would be simpler and it would make more sense if it was simply a Blast of some kind. I also think the weapon would be considerably cooler if it was a Vortex weapon, a rule which in my opinion is used far too little, or rather has far too few instances in which it can be used, this is a rather perfect weapon for having the Vortex rule. I think something like a Large Blast Vortex Strength D AP 1 blast should be 40-100 pts, if you decide to keep the current one it should be at least 40 pts.

Fairy nuff I've been trying to figure out the best way to represent the Morrallian's Anomaly Warheads, which are essentially S.TA.L.K.E.R anomalies in pokeballs "Go gravity pulse", this was the latest attempt (see the anomaly grenades below & weep at my first attempt), but I still don't like it.

Might run with a Super-Heavy Gunship armed with massive Flamers instead. The Greater Meh (talk) 22:22, 23 December 2015 (UTC)

Waste Runners

I find their ability to take ion grenades odd since the fluff is that ion weaponry is a form of plasma weaponry and therefore, ion grenades would be just like plasma grenades with the only difference being terminology. I would also make Pulse Grenades be S4 AP4 like plasma grenades since it sounds like it's basically plasma as well.--Ilniaj (talk) 17:00, 3 April 2015 (UTC)

Okay I really don't get where the whole "Ion weapon is Plasma Weapon under different name" thing comes from, the physics are the same, but mechanically they are vastly different, Ion Weaponry magnetically projects a stream of highly Ionised particles from a contained Plasma reaction, that break whatever they hit into a plasma state, vaporising the target fast enough to turn it into plasma and creating a short-lived self-sustaining reaction, while Plasma weapons fire a Stream of actual plasma. So while it might not have the same AP as Plasma, it does have a lot more stopping power, essentially as the grenade is basically a mini Fusion device that is induced into an overload state, releasing a cloud of Ionising particles, (it's basically a mind-melting cross between a Melta Bomb, and a Plasma Grenade). Ion Weaponry is a very advanced, and soft sci-fi version of this [[12]]

The pulse grenade I kept at the same strength as all basic Tau Pulse weaponry mostly because S:5, AP5 is the Pulse statline, giving it multiple hits because there's no pulse 'Blast' weapon that I know of (besides the Pulse Submunition rifle for the XV-107, and that's mounted on a freaking Gundam for Aun'Va's sake)

Anomaly Grenades

Working on the Morrallian's super heavy weapons, used a mix of Void grenades, and Anomalies from the S.T.A.L.K.E.R series to come up with the basic idea for these, but they're not finished yet. The Greater Meh (talk) 22:31, 8 July 2015 (UTC)

Holy crap that is a lot of rules for that. You may want to streamline it a bitDragoon508 (talk) 22:51, 8 July 2015 (UTC)

Gravitational Anomalies

Vortex – Range 8”, S:X, AP2, Assault Y, Graviton, Drag, Anomaly, Growth/Degrade

Whirligig – Range 8”, S:X, AP2, Assault Y, Hurl, Drag, Anomaly, Spawn/Degrade

Freefall – Range 8”, S:-, AP-, Assault Y, Null, Drag, Anomaly, Spawn/Degrade

Fire Anomalies

Burner – Range 8”, S:6, AP5, Assault Y, Anomaly, Soul-Blaze, Spawn/Degrade

Comet – Range 8”, S:8, AP3, Assault Y, Anomaly, Soul-Blaze, Meteoric, Free Roaming/Degrade

Fault – Range 8”, S:6, AP5, Assault Y, Anomaly, Soul-Blaze, War-scaper, Growth/Degrade

Chemical Anomalies

Fruit Punch – Range 8”, S:1, AP4, Assault Y, Poison (2+), Anomaly, Melt, Spawn/Degrade

Gas – Range 8”, S:1, AP-, Assault Y, Poison (2+), Anomaly, Enfeeble, Free Roaming/Degrade

Witch’s Jelly – Range 8”, S:1, AP2, Assault Y, Poison (2+), Consume, Anomaly, Growth/Degrade

Electrical Anomalies

Electro – Range 8”, S:3, AP5, Assault Y, Haywire, Chain Reaction, Anomaly, Spawn/Degrade

Tesla – Range 8”, S:3, AP3, Assault Y, Haywire, Anomaly, Discharge, Free-Roaming/Degrade

Anomaly Rules

Assault Y – An Anomaly Containment Grenade/Active Anomaly inflicts a number of automatic hits equal to the number of Models in the unit under attack, these hits happen regardless of any rules that force “to Hit” re-rolls, such as the Eldars Holo-Fields.

Growth/Degrade – An anomaly with these rules is placed on the Battlefield as a “Large Blast” Template, at the beginning of each players Movement phase roll a D6, on a 6+ the anomaly expands, increase its template size by 2”, on a roll of 1 the Anomaly degrades, decreasing its template size by 2”. An Anomaly cannot grow beyond 15”, and if it shrinks below 3” it disappears entirely.

Spawn/Degrade – An Anomaly with these special rules is placed on the Battlefield as a Blast Template, at the beginning of each movement phase roll both the scatter dice, and a d6 for each anomaly of this type on the battlefield, on a 1, the anomaly disappears, its energy expended, on a 6+ another anomaly of the same type spawns on the board, place another blast template down in contact with the spawning anomaly in the direction that the scatter dice shows (As the barrage USR).

Free-Roaming/Degrade – An anomaly with these rules is placed on the battlefield as a Large Blast Template, at the beginning of each movement phase roll the scatter dice, the anomaly then scatters as directed, use the small arrow on the HIT dice face to determine direction, however on a result of any doubles on the distance dice, the anomaly shrinks to a Blast template, and on the next roll of doubles it disappears entirely, its energy expended.

Drag – Any model that starts its movement phase within 12” of the edge of a Gravitational anomaly must make a Strength test or be dragged 2d6” towards the anomaly. If any models base touches the Anomaly template, then the unit suffers another attack with the anomalies profile.

Hurl – Whenever an anomaly with this rule inflicts a wound on a unit, after resolving the initial attack, the unit is thrown 2d6” directly away from the anomaly, each model in the unit suffers a S:X AP- hit where X is equal to the distance the unit is thrown (rolls of 11 or 12 are treated as S:D), if their movement would have them move through, or land in, the same space as another unit (Friendly or not) that unit takes a number of hits equal to the number of models in the hurled unit at the same strength as the Hurled unit.

Null – Whenever a unit suffers a hit from this anomaly it must make an Initiative test or be held helplessly in the air as they are trapped in a pocket of null gravity. They may re-roll this test at the beginning of each of their movement phases, should they succeed this Initiative test they are then either allowed to move as normal (if they succeeded on the first initiative test) or are subject to the Hurl rule, and are thrown 1d6” for every failed test (Use counters or coins to mark down the number of failed tests). While units are trapped in the null fields they may not benefit from cover saves other than the shrouded USR, and any unit shooting at the trapped unit may re-roll to-hits rolls.

Issues with Morrallian

Immunity is super, super niche. Like, poison only matters against targets with like T5+. Morrallians cap out at T4. Most of them are T2. You could make it flat immunity to poison and it wouldn't really matter. Except the council thing handing it out... but it still would not be super relevant.

How's this for a replacement rule then? The Greater Meh (talk) 18:17, 25 September 2015 (UTC)

Redundancy (3+): The Morrallian Auxiliaries employed by the Tau are almost entirely reliant on their HEVA Suits to protect them against both the own environment and the Alien environments they have to operate in, to this end the internal systems of these suits are made to act as a highly advanced life support system, alongside a ‘battery’ of advanced medical Nanites which can act in place of a damaged organ or mechanism for long enough that the wearer can either find medical help or take his enemies with him. This rule grants the model immunity to Instant Death caused by Weapon Strength, and once per game can force an opponent to re-roll all successful wounds against the unit on the number following Redundancy.

Morrallian MOPP Troops are 2ppm more expensive then Morrallian Deathsworn. for those 2ppm, you lose max squad size, Transport options(the best part of Deathsworn), access to pulse rifles, and 1 WS. You gain... Immunity 5+ instead of 4+. on a T2 model. Really?

Added a couple of options, that might be fun The Greater Meh (talk) 13:46, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Morrallian Undying, for the same price I could have crisis suits. With Jet,+1T,+2S,-1WS, and no S&P. I guess that it is the HS slot rather then elites... but HS is also full of better options.

Morrallian Returned, for 12 points less, I get troop snipers with -1BS and -1W. Sniper weapons are actually only really relevant in massive quantities(you want those 1/36 rend+precision). When I can buy 2.5 models for the price of one, in a better slot...

Morrallian Black Hound, funny fact, the unit gets better if the kennel masters commit suicide. Like... really, you just end up sticking the kennel masters at the head of the unit, and hoping the enemy shoots him to death. Better to put the kennel masters on some kind of bike or something. So they can use that beast movement.

Thinking he could ride them into Battle, also need to make a "character" hound, mostly as a piece of fluff The Greater Meh (talk) 13:46, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Morrallian Death-Walker, Units with no options are really sad.

I'm Workin' on it (read in brooklyn accent) The Greater Meh (talk) 13:46, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Morrallian Dullahan’s Carriage, for 5 points more, you can buy a flyer. The flyer is just better. Also, nearly no options. Come on guys.

Once agains, I'm Workin' on it The Greater Meh (talk) 13:46, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Morrallian Flyers, I am going to be doing this sort of commentary for all the races, and I have a rule. I won't comment on units I just like, because that doesn't really fit with the theme of pointing out issues with the codex. Just have to say, each and every one of these look sexy, and I want to have their children.

I'm not sure how to respond to that, just gonna say I'm working on a "Ace Pilot" character that may be taken as an upgrade to the Raven, kinda like Longstrike, Pask, or Chronus, expect for Helicopters The Greater Meh (talk) 13:46, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

One of the first playtests I did had the morrallian's at a high point cost, where I was paying about 14 points a model for some of the units, they still probably need a points drop on a lot of the units to be honest but need play testing as well. So I think the Dullahan's carriage is one of the units that will defiantly get a points drop when we playtest it. I will let groggarith chime in if he wants to do a rewrite on immunity and the points drop since this is one of the races he has made. Dragoon508 (talk) 03:01, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

Formosians

So I got a possible idea for this race. We have sort of been making a lot of high leadership races which is fine. But my idea for this race, using the image from the xeno picture at the far left, is to make a somewhat low leadership unit that is sort of a blob army. Weapon wise I am thinking of making them a bit of a mid range unit as we have done a lot of long range and short range units.

Name	WS	BS	S	T	W	I	A	Ld	Sv
Formosian	3	3	3	4	1	3	1	5	5+

Make them a bit tougher than normal but they don't like to fight so much. Special rules wise I am thinking of playing them off of passing leadership tests based on how many they killed last turn. So they could get leader 10 if they killed five models the last turn. Thoughts on this?

It could be interesting, Blob armies aren't my speed though, and that leadership rule sounds like it could get confusing fast, especially in assaults, and long-Range Blasts (Railgun Submunitions, artillery) could really fuck their shit up, while their own Blasts could buff their Leadership to stratospheric levels, so that might be something to watch out for. Groggarioth March 9 16:42 (UK)

So I gave it more thought lately on how I want to run the Formosians. Still going to have low leadership and be a blob army. However the units will probably be at a mid range, with no long range power. I am thinking they will use a shotgun like weapon for the basic troops. Then the higher ups will have a different kind of shotgun with armor piercing. Overall all the weapons will have assault, probably assault 2, so a full blob of 20 would roll about 40 dice.

I think the special rule I will give them is if they go to ground they dig in and get a +2 to cover save when they do. Possibly make them immune to pinning. Thoughts?Dragoon508 (talk) 07:07, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

So fluff wise the formosians are big on genetic engineering and growing their soldiers to be disposable. The HQ for this unit will probably be something along more of a support HQ than a combat hq, giving buffs to the units. If I decide to go that route. This faction will not have a lot of units since besides the grown soldiers they do not really battle, regulating them to more of a support race similer to how the Niccassar are.

I am thinking of dropping Formosians from the codex and keeping them more of an economic race like the greet and brachayas are. Thoughts on this?Dragoon508 (talk) 05:17, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

Formosian Vat-Tailored Bodyguards

Would it be possible to make a Formosian HQ Bodyguard (Like a Crisis Bodyguard Team) unit which is possible to tailor in any way possible, like each Pod Breeder makes their own personal Bodyguard, and each is almost completely unique entity in & of itself. In tabletop terms, it's basically a Model you build and equip from the ground up, using Evil's FAVIX system, could even be a point to have a Unique HQ character who has the option to take more than 1 Bodyguards. Starting stats could below be for 60 Points. What do you think? The Greater Meh (talk) 01:09, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

I think it is possible to come up with a bodyguard unit for them, however it probably won't be a build a bear unit like you are thinking of. those stats are pretty high that you got so far as well. Let me look through some stuff and I will get back to you with some possible idea's on this.Dragoon508 (talk) 01:15, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

So a possible idea I had was to make them like rat ogres from fantasy, since those are kind of the mad scientist theme we have for the formosian's. They are made big and strong so the pod breeder can hide behind them as he jams needles into the formosians with the brews to enhance them.Dragoon508 (talk) 04:10, 31 August 2015 (UTC)

So if we're making them like Rat Ogres from the Skaven would the following statline be more appropriate The Greater Meh (talk) 22:11, 31 August 2015 (UTC)

I like what you got so far but for a few changes. The pinning and ap 3 probably should not go in there. With assualt 4 and str 6 it is pretty potent already. That is basically like an auto cannon but better. Without command probably should work like stupidity did in fantasy or how servitors work without a leaderDragoon508 (talk) 01:33, 11 September 2015 (UTC)

Okay so a couple more options, with hopefully a slightly less offensively potent build, I'm running off of the logic that these guys are defensive models, and hopefully that's come across in the wargear choices and Special Rules, also I ripped Mindlock directly out of the Astra Militarum 'Dex, from the Servitor entry, I thought the original was what Fantasy had for stupidity, but I've never player it, and with Age of Sigmar, probably never will, also trying to think of a Name for the Formosian Unique HQ, what do you think of "'Goldvial' Vink" (Naming is my weak-point, attack it for massive ego damage), the Crank gun could be downscaled for the Formosian Pod-Born as maybe (Range 18", S:3, AP-, Salvo 1d6/2d6, Misfire) The Greater Meh (talk) 16:49, 11 September 2015 (UTC)

So was thinking on this on and off for a few days, first off stupidity basically made a unit walk in a straight line. Anyways I like how you have them currently but may need a few fine tuning still, most likely a points increase. I will let evil also chime in on thoughts in this regard. As for a Formosian unique, if you got an idea then go for it although was not really expecting them to have a unique. Goldvial probably is not a good nickname though.Dragoon508 (talk) 02:50, 16 September 2015 (UTC)

I have been summoned! Anyway, let me know when you've got the final statline down for the wargear and units, then I'll take a crack at looking over their stats. Evilexecutive (talk) 03:13, 16 September 2015 (UTC)

Bodyguard: Formosian Vat-Beast/Fiend - 55 Points

Name	WS	BS	S	T	W	I	A	Ld	Sv
Vat-Beast	3	4	5	5	3	4	2	6	4+
Vat-Fiend	4	3	5	5	3	4	2+1	6	4+

Wargear (Beast): Heavy Alloy Cannon (Range 30", S:6, AP5, Assault 4, Spread-Shot), Overgrown Armour (4+)

Wargear (Fiend): 2 Formosian Bone-Claws (S:User, AP4, Rending, Shred, Strikedown), Overgrown Armour (4+)

Options:

• A Formosian Pod-Breeder may purchase up to 2 Vat-Beasts or Vat-Fiends in any combination as a retinue for their listed cost.
• (Both) May Purchase a Auto-Injection Delivery system Vial to a maximum of 3 10 Points/Vial
• (Both) May purchase a Tau Shield Generator for 25 Points
• (Beast) May replace its Heavy Alloy Cannon with a Heavy Alloy Crank Gun (Range 24", S:4 AP6, Heavy 2d6, Misfire) for 15 Points
• (Beast) May Purchase Rapid Reaction Optic Accentuators for 15 Points
• (Fiend) May purchase Adrenal-Glands, the model gains the Furious Charge USR 5 Points
• (Fiend) May upgrade weapon with Reinforced Bone Claws (S:+2) 15 Points
• (Fiend) May purchase Accelerated Defensive Purposing for 5 Points

Auto-Injection Delivery System Vial: Once per game, a Model equipped with this piece of wargear may choose to benefit from the effects of a Formosian Pod-Breeders Unstable Concoctions Special Rule even if this model is not within 12" of a Formosian Pod Breeder.

Rapid Reaction Optic Accentuators: A model with this piece of Wargear fires Overwatch at +2 BS.

Accelerated Defensive Purposing Grants the model the Counter-Attack USR

Special Rules:

• Unthinking Loyalty - Automatically Passes "Look Out Sir" rolls
• Feel no Pain (4+)
• Misfire: When rolling 2d6 for this weapons number of attacks, any roll of doubles causes the wielder to suffer a hit with the weapons strength, Armour & Invulnerable saves may be made against this attack.
• For The Master!!! - Must always preform a Glorious Intervention whenever the Formosian Pod-Breeder is issued or issues a challenge
• To The Last - Should this unit lose it's last wound while in a Challenge it violently explodes, deal a number of hits equal to this models number of Attacks with the following profile S:X, AP- to the model that removed this model, (X is equal to this models Toughness)
• Mindlock - Unless it includes an Formosian Pod-Breeder, an unengaged unit that contains at least one model with this special rule must roll a D6 at the start of its turn. On a roll of a 4+, this special rule has no effect this turn. On a roll of a 1, 2 or 3, the unit is mindlocked until the start of its following turn. A mindlocked unit may not voluntarily move, shoot or charge. A mindlocked unit must still complete compulsory moves, such as Pile In and Fall Back moves.

You mentioned my name

Formosian Pod-Born Special Weapons

What it says on the tin, this is a way of offering some extra variety to Pod-Born Squads with the weapon coming with some rather obvious drawbacks as the Pod-Breeders don't really care if the Pod-Born die, 1 model in 5 may take a Special Weapon Choice what do you guys think? The Greater Meh (talk) 23:48, 12 September 2015 (UTC)

So instead of giving the get's hot rule, probobally should just inflict an attack on the unit at the strength of the weapon. So for instance the crank gun would give a S 3 hit, which you roll to wound as normal with an armor save. Not sure how I feel about the flame spewer with multiple template coming off of it, but maybe make blast back a roll of 1-2.Dragoon508 (talk) 02:47, 16 September 2015 (UTC)

An alteration to Blastback to make it safer to fire once, but more dangerous to fire multiple times, so if your luck is shitty and you roll a 1 for the shooting attacks, you're less likely to explode as the weapon has less overheating problems, what think you guys?. The Greater Meh (talk) 20:17, 9 October 2015 (UTC)

Name	Range	S	AP	Type
Alloy Crank Gun	18"	3	-	Heavy 2d6, Misfire 10 points
Formosian Flame Spewer	Template	4	5	Assault 1d3, Blastback 10 Points
Hallucinogen Grenade Launcher	24"	-	-	Heavy 1, Hallucination, Blast 15 points

• Misfire: When rolling 2d6 for this weapons number of attacks, any roll of doubles causes the wielder to suffer a wound with the weapons strength, Armour Saves or Invulnerable saves may be made against this wound.
• Blastback: After each time this weapon fires in the Shooting Phase, or as an overwatch action, roll a d6, if the roll is equal to, or lower than number of times this weapon has been fired, place a Blast Marker Centered on the wielder, all models under the Marker suffer a S:4, AP5, Ignores Cover attack taht wounds as normal, Armour & Invulnerable saves may be made against these wounds, all shots are fired before these wounds are allocated.
• Hallucination: Any units under this Weapons Blast Marker must make a Ld check on 3d6 or suffer the effects of the Hallucination Psychic Power in the Telepathy Discipline, units with Fearless instead test on 2d6

Super Heavies

Would it be worth making a couple of Super Heavies, like a modified Baneblade for the Gue'Vesa, a Dune Worm for the Tarellians, a Goliath Gargantuan Creature for the Thraxians, that sort of thing Groggarioth March 9 16:42 (UK)

I would keep the goliath gargantuan creature alone, since that is a little to like the tyrinids. The dune worm sounds like a good idea but expect a shit ton of Dune references 5ever for it. As for the baneblade, I kind of want to stay away from pure IG stuff as much as possible at least on the rare stuff like baneblades and titans since that stuff is pretty rare. If the Tau got their hands on one of those it is most likely that they would be in pieces in some earth caste lab somewhere.Dragoon508 (talk) 19:19, 9 March 2015 (UTC)

Having never read, or seen, Dune I feel somewhat certain that any references, apart from "The Spice Must Flow" or "Spoony in his Harkonan Thong" will fly right over my head (not a big Sci-Fi fan to be honest)

So I was sitting here thinking about the Demiurge super heavy, but an idea came into my head about what would a Gue'vesa super heavy be. My design thoughts of the Gue'vesa has always been a mixture of tau tech and imp guard tech, blending it into something of a middle range between the two.

Then it hit me. They would make this [13], one of the ultimate fusions of two techs. Besides sort of wanting to keep battlesuit tech to tau only, I think this may work as a vehicle. Maybe. Thoughts on this train of thought before I go further?Dragoon508 (talk) 08:53, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

Seeing that almost instantly reminds me of an Ork Gargant, although it does seem like something that the Gue'vesa could put together, the Torso (which could be easily repaired by the Earth Caste) is instantly eye-catching, and would probably attract fire, while the tracks (Probably from a Baneblade) would be low enough to not attract fire, and tracks are easy enough to repair and protect.

Might also be worth looking at this [[14]] Groggarioth (talk) 18:01, 19 March 2015 (UK)

Yea that is basically the Tau titan that chapter house made. It is pretty cool looking. I just thought of some good fluff for the unit. BAsically the Gue'vesa are taking the old style XV-88s and mounting them on tank treds. Giving them more stability and therefore able to fit a bigger gun on them. Could give them a heavy railgun, although I think probably a new kind of weapon may be best. I do know the hands will be a smart missle system. I know the guntank in Gundam uses recoiless rifles, so maybe give it an anti infantry and anti tank mode with it. Hmmmm still got to think on what all would be on it.

Rail-guns with the ability to switch between Solid-Slug Munitions, and Scatter Sub-Munitions be the best way to do the Recoilless rifles with Anti-Tank/Anti-Infantry, heavy Burst Cannons for the Arms, that can be exchanged for a Modified version of Smart-Missile Systems Cluster Missile System (Range 48”, S:5, AP4, Assault 8, Homing, Ignores Cover, might work, sadly I've never watched Gundam, or Macross, I'm more of a Code Geass fan Groggarioth (talk) 18:22, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

I kind of wanted to avoid using railguns to give the super heavy its own flavor and not step on the Tau's feet about it. However looking at it more and more I think going with twinlinked rail guns may be for the best. I can even think of the lore for it as well. They are using the old broadside battlesuits and remounting them to baneblades. I will put up what I got for it this weekend. really busy this week, same with my other stuff I got planned. Dragoon508 (talk) 07:48, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

Basic Stat line (Expect Editing)

Tarellian Dune Worm (Gargantuan Creature, cost 1150 points)

 WS | BS | S | T | W | I | A | Ld | Sv
  5 | -- | 9 | 7 | 6 | 5 | 8 |  5 | 2+

Wargear

• Dune Worm Maw (S: User, AP1, Rending, Shred)
• Dune Worm Hide (Armour 2+, Invulnerable 5++)

Special Rules

• Swallow Whole: If this model deals an unsaved wound to an infantry model or a Monstrous Creature without the "Extremely Bulky" Rule, that model is Swallowed Whole, it may make a single Invulnerable save, if it has one, if it fails, it is removed from play. This does not count as Instant Death for the Purpose of Eternal Warrior.
• Smash
• Burrow: An unengaged Dune Worm can, at any point during its Movement phases from the second game turn onwards, elect to burrow. If it does so, remove it from the table and place it into Ongoing Reserves. A Dune Worm cannot Deep Strike and Burrow in the same turn.
• Terror From The Deep: When arriving from Deep Strike Reserve, a Dune Worm can choose to Deep Strike onto a point occupied by another model (friend or foe) – roll for scatter as normal. If a Dune Worm Deep Strikes onto a point occupied by another model, do not roll on the Deep Strike Mishap table. Instead, place the Apocalypse blast marker directly over the spot the Dune Worm is deep striking onto. All units except Flyers and Flying Monstrous Creatures beneath the blast marker suffer a number of Strength 8 AP1 hits with the Ignores Cover special rule equal to the number of models that unit has underneath the blast marker. If the blast marker is on a multi-level ruin, only models on the lowest level of the ruin count as being under the blast marker. For Wound allocation purposes, assume the attack is coming from the centre of the blast marker. Hits against vehicles are resolved against their side armour. If, after removing casualties, it is now possible to place the Dune Worm on the table on the spot where the blast marker landed, then do so, even if this is within 1" of another model (but not if it would be in base contact with, or occupying the same space as, another model). If it is not possible to place the Dune Worm, replace the large blast marker on the spot and resolve another round of damage as detailed above. If, after removing casualties for a second time, it is still not possible to place the Dune Worm, roll on the Deep Strike Mishap table.
• Undeniable Fear: Units must test on heroic morale (Fearless units test for fear at full Leadership)
• Fearless
• Armour-bane
• Flesh-bane
• Hideously Bulky: Cannot be Transported (No Shit Sherlock)
• Feel No Pain (3+)
• Eternal Warrior
• It Will Not Die (4+)

Am almost tempted to give it Psyker Mastery lvl 3 just to complete the Dune reference, but it would make no sense as to why this Giant Worm would be a capable Psyker, on par with a trained Space MArine Chaplain. Groggarioth 20:12 March 9 (UK)

What do you think? Groggarioth 21:03 March 10 (UK)

I would defiantly lower the wounds on this thing. It is basically impossible to kill since it will regain wounds with it will not die. Add that with feel no pain, high toughness, and a big armor save it is basically going to be stronk as all hell. I would probably drop some of the toughness as well to maybe 6 or 7. Terror from the deep seems a little too op in the fact you can attack with it twice. I would only have it go off once.

Dropped the wounds from 8 to 6, and Toughness from 9 to 7, although that makes it easy for a S:D weapon to kill it in a single hit (D6+6 Wounds, No Invulnerable or Cover Saves), I'm also against altering the rules for Burrow & Terror from the Deep, seeing as I lifted them directly from the Tyranid Codex, might increase the points cost as well though 850 to 1150 Groggarioth 23:28 March 10 (UK)

Oh that is fair enough. No one around here plays tyrinids anymore so I sorta forgot about that. D weapons probably will be a pain for the worm but it has the benifit of burrowing when those are around and trying to swallow them. I see this heavy being a good anti infantry unit Heck it looks like there may even be a model you can buy to represent it [15], so that helps out there. I still think this monster is going to be tough to kill however even with a D strength weapon

Modified "Swallow Whole" so as to clarify what it does Groggarioth (talk) 23:16, 11 March 2015 (UK)

A portion of me still feels like this thing will be a rape train. However if you are paying 1k+ points on it well it does make sense that way. As is probably is ready to be added in.

Gue'Vesa Decom XV-88 Bane-Crawler

So yeah, this is my attempt at creating the Gue'Vesa's super heavy Guntank, wanted to see just how on the nose I was with this The Greater Meh (talk) 12:12, 31 March 2015 (UTC)

This is good, however my only suggestion is to get rid of the rail gun and give them a twin-linked heavy rail gun. That will give them minor titan killing power while keeping a lot of anti infantry power with the burst cannons.

added this in while changing the designation to the 112 to mark the codes used by the tau for their battlesuits. Reduced the HP to 3 to reflect the same as a baneblade, thoughts to add to this would be a shield generator to give it a 5++ saveDragoon508 (talk) 00:20, 19 June 2015 (UTC)

Dude, a regular Baneblade has 12 HP (4 StP, a Structure Point, which have now been dropped, is equivalent to 3 Hull Points), 3 HP would basically give to same survivability as a Leman Russ, so that Hp amount NEEDS to be changed The Greater Meh (talk) 00:57, 19 June 2015 (UTC)

My bad, forgot to change it to StP. Got them crossed because I was stareing at units all day today brainstormingDragoon508 (talk) 01:07, 19 June 2015 (UTC)

Not sure if we should have them use missile drones, they would be the option everyone would pick because the only thing better than the missiles would be the pinning on the twin linked pulse carbines. It beats it out on range easily

How about these options, they'll turn it into a real defensive beast, or if you grab Marker Drones and let them loose something, exceptionally scary. The Greater Meh (talk) 16:00, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

Name	BS	FAV	SAV	RAV	HP
XV-112 Bane-Crawler	3	14	13	12	9

Unit Composition: 1 XV-112

Unit Type: Vehicle (Tank, Super heavy)

Wargear: Twin-Linked Heavy Rail Gun (With Sub-Munitions), 2 Heavy Burst Cannons, 4 Twin-Linked Long-Barreled Burst Cannons, Blacksun Filter, Velocity Tracker

Options:

• May replace either Heavy Burst Cannon with a Cluster Missile System for 20 Points/each
• May take up to 8 Seeker Missiles 8 Points/Missile
• May replace any Twin-linked Long-Barrelled Burst Cannons with a Twin-Linked High Yield Missile Pod for 5 points/each
• May replace any Twin-linked Long-Barrelled Burst Cannons with an Ion Cannon for 5 Points/each
• May replace any Twin-linked Long-Barrelled Burst Cannons with a Twin-Linked Thunderhead Plasma Cannon for 10 Points/each
• May take up to 6 Gun Drones or 6 Markerlight Drones for 12 Points/Drone
• May purchase an Advanced Targeting Array for 20 Points (Increases Vehicles BS by +1)
• May purchase a Heavy Flechette Dispersal System for 20 Points (During the Assault phase, every unit in Base contact suffers a number of S:4, AP-, Rending, Shred hits equal to the number of models it has in base contact, this happens at Initiative 10)
• May Purchase an Advanced Points Defence Targeting System for 25 Points (Allow this vehicle to fire overwatch with any S:5 or lower weapon)

Pakasar

So I'm working on the Pakasar, I'm trying to make them similar to Marines in stats and equipment, with the Rage, and occasionally Rampage USR's what do you think of this?

Pakasar Deep Warrior (Troops, Infantry, 60 Points, Unit Composition 4 Deep Warriors)

Pakasar Deep Warrior (Infantry)

 WS | BS | S | T | W | I | A | Ld | Sv
  4 |  2 | 3 | 4 | 1 | 4 | 2 |  6 | 3+

Pakasar Deep Fang (Infantry, Character)

 WS | BS | S | T | W | I | A | Ld | Sv
  4 |  2 | 3 | 4 | 1 | 4 | 3 |  8 | 3+

Wargear

• Hydrojet Darter (Range 24”, S:4, AP5, Rapid Fire)
• Electroreceptor Blade (Melee, S:User, AP3)
• Ocean Power Armour (Armour 3+)

Special Rules

• Rage
• Rampage (Deep Fang Only)

Options

• May take up to 4 Additional Deep Warriors (15 Points/Model)
• Any Deep Warrior may Exchange their Hydrojet Darter for an additional Electroreceptor Blade (free)
• 1 Deep Warrior May Exchange their Hydrojet Darter& Electroreceptor Blade for a Heavy Hydrojet Darter (Range 36”, S:5, AP4, Heavy 3) (5 Points)
• A Unit of Pakasar Deep Warriors may take Compressed Hydropak Grenades (Assault Grenades) (4 points/model)
• 1 Deep Warrior may be upgraded to a Deep Fang (10 Points)
• A Deep Fang may exchange their Hydrojet Darter for an additional Electroreceptor Blade (free)
• A Deep Fang may Exchange his Hydrojet Darter for a Hydrosurge Darter (Range 24”, S:4, AP5, Assault 2)

Groggarioth

The Pakasar are pretty much finished, just working on a bit of fluff for all their units, and a bit of a story on how the Tau conquered them, should have at least the units up on Saturday Groggarioth (talk) 19:00, 19 March 2015 (UK)

Pakasar Special Character

Does anyone have the exact wording for the Lizardmen's "Instinctual Predator" Rule from their 8th edition Army Book, I was hoping to use something similair for a HQ unit for the Pakasar Groggarioth March 17th

Looked through the armybook and can't find that rule I am afraid.Dragoon508 (talk) 08:55, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

Sorry, I think I meant "Predatory Fighter" it's supposed to allow additional attacks if they roll a 6 on the "to hit" dice Groggarioth (talk) 16:30, 18 March 2015 (UK)

W henever a model with this special rule rolls a 6 To H it in close combat, it immediately makes another Attack; roll To H it and To W ound as normal. Attacks generated by the Predatory Fighter special rule do not generate further Attacks. In addition, a unit that contains one or more models with this special rule can only test to restrain pursuit if there is at least one Skink character model (Skink C hief or Skink Priest, including Tehenhauin, Tetto’eko and T iktaq’to) within 6" o f the unit.

Excellent, I don't think pursuit is a part of 40K, so I'll leave that part out, but thanks man. Groggarioth

Deep Ocean Power Armour

Okqay so making Deep Ocean Power Armour I wanted it to be a Terminator equivalent piece, but I didn't know Terminator armour is so pimped out, so I'd like to buff it up a little more, however I'd like to make sure that it's not the exact same as Termie Armour any ideas? Groggarioth (talk) 23:18, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

Stick to how it is now, a 2+ save is still pretty damn good. I imagine it kind of looks like the big daddy armor to be honest. Having a 2+ saves is one of the best saves in the game, even if you face a plasma heavy list. Dragoon508 (talk) 07:42, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

Less Big Daddy and more this [16], crossed with this [17] The Greater Meh (talk) 17:02, 28 March 2015 (UTC)

They're meant to be like Big Daddy Suits? I better add the bulky special rule to it then. I figured that the Pakasar would need deep ocean power armour for the very deep places where the pressure is too high for them to survive. --Ilniaj (talk) 19:16, 29 March 2015 (UTC)

More like this: Jet-Stream Armour - Bulky, Ocean Armour - Very Bulky, Deep Ocean Armour - Extremely Bulky, it's got to be remembered that a Pakasar Coastal Warrior in Jet-Stream Armour is about 6 1/2 feet tall (Or Roughly a bit bigger than a Stealth Suit), and they're the smaller ones, Ocean Power Armour goes to somewhere in the realm of 7 ft - 8 ft, but presents a much larger profile to make up for pressure displacers, water-tanks, surge Pack Mounts, hydraulic drives, and other sub-systems, and Deep Ocean can vary between the size of an XV-46 Void suit, to an XV-88 if it's being made for a Behemoth Warrior The Greater Meh (talk) 20:38, 29 March 2015 (UTC)

Space Marines don't have the Bulky special rule and they are 7 to 8 feet tall depending on the source. Jet-Stream and Ocean Power Armour should be normal and Deep Ocean should be Bulky.--Ilniaj (talk) 21:31, 29 March 2015 (UTC)

Wha? but... that... MAKES NO SENSE, GROGGY SMASH (Maybe it's to do with their own personal transport and space constraints, and it relative to the transport size rather than creature size) The Greater Meh (talk) 21:38, 29 March 2015 (UTC)

Misc Equipment

Working on some Miscellaneous Equipment for the Pakasar, what do you think of this stuff

Impulse Reflector This advanced piece of wargear is made from the Pakasar's gravitic accelerator technology, whenever an enemy tries to charge the reflector strikes back at him with force of his charge. A Pakasar unit that contains a model with this piece of equipment may make a single attack at Initiative step 10 whenever they are charged, this attack is resolved at S:2d6 AP-

Magnetic Shield Some suits of Deep Ocean Power Armour are equipped with these advanced Magnetic Shield systems, the Magnetic Shield stops enemy projectiles in their tracks, and launches their own projectile out with greater force A Model equipped with this gains a 6++ Inv Save, and their Ranged attacks gain +1S and 6" range.

Combat Stimulants These drugs are often used by Pakasar warriors during battle, whipping them into a frenzy of violence and bloodlust, where they fall upon their enemies in a storm of carnage A Unit of Pakasar equipped with these may increase their WS by +1, but must make a Ld check, if they fail they automatically fail all Battle-Madness checks and their BS is reduced to 1

Typhoons Strike (Relic) The legends told of this blade in Pakasar culture are many, some say it was forged in a single lightning strike, some say it was made out of the bones of Sekara, the Pakasar's goddess of storms, others say that it contains all the spirits of the Pakasar Warriors who fell in battle, regardless of whether or not these legends are true those who wield his blade swear that they can hear the low rumble of storms rolling in. This is a Master Crafted Electroreceptor Blade with the Profile Range Melee, S:x2, AP2, Blinds, Master-Crafted, Haywire

Issues with Pakasar

First, there is way to much of the wheel being reinvented. I probably read the entire codex twice before I even looked past the giant wall of pointless text in the wargear section.

Suggested general change is that were there is an existing piece of wargear that is exactly the same as the wargear you made, put the better known wargear in parentheses next to it. Like Hydrojet Darter Pistol(Bolt Pistol), or Ocean Power Armour(power armor). Like, most of the unit entries make me scroll bacck and forth more then I am actually reading.

Now then, skipping way down the list, the Pakasar Trident ATC Skimmer. What the fuck? So, for 10 points less then a Land Raider, you get one with 3 heavy bolters... -1 HP, -1FAV, -2F&RAV, Worse access points and skimmer. I guess it can jink? A 4+ cover save is nice, but this is competing with the sand Junker as a transport. You know the sand Junker with +6 transport capacity and costs less then 24% of this giant thing? Also, unless you add an HQ, None of the units you would put in this thing cost more then the transport.

Yeah Nope, I didn't think units could get thicker and more annoying to read then the Hrenians. I was wrong, this is basically unreadable. So many fiddly bits, and tons of special rules. Also having to remember what translates to what is annoying.

Auxiliary Allies Matrix

It occurred to me, that not all auxiliaries would work together willingly, even with the Tau, as a Unified force. Would it be worth, once we've got all the different species worked out, making up an allies matrix for the various Auxiliaries and what other forces in the 40K universe that they might work with? Especially considering the mercenary nature of the Galg, The Tarellians, the Morrallians, or Chaos Tainted Gue'Vesa? Groggarioth (talk) 00:00, 19 March 2015 (UK)

I have been mulling over this exact same thing last night actually on how I would want to present this. My thoughts are that the ally matrix will be similar to base tau. You can take these units by themselves or add them to an existing tau force. The Gue'vesa may modify the ally matrix if taken with an imperial guard ally or imperial guard with a Gue'Vesa ally. Making the guard Battle brothers with tau and giving the traitor rule to the entire guard codex, along with making them desperate allies with the entire imperium.

However the issue with this is I would not want to mix up the Allies matrix too much, Chaos tainted Gue'Vesa would just be a Lost and the Damned force, not something for this codex I think. It is a tough call because if we mix up the ally matrix too much it can be a bit silly. Honestly a separate codex for mercs could be in order, do a mix of Kroot mercs, Galg, Ork Freebootaz, and Tarellians. (I like to think that the Morallians are a part of the Tau empre although we don't know for sure.) That way we don't need to change the ally matrix for this codex and give an option for another codex.

My thoughts on that is the mercs codex would be allies of connivance with everyone and have some different overarching rules and some additional units compared to this one. For instance a paymaster that can be a different race based on what you pick, so if you are using mainly Tarellians for instance you can use a Tarallian paymaster that gives different rules. To help different that one from this one I have the idea of a Tau Water Caste member who joins squads and gives them benefits like an etheral being able to buff that unit, but if instead you pulled the Tarellians from Codex Mercenaries you would not be able to put that water caste member into that unit. IF that makes sense, this is a very very rough idea that has been floating around.Dragoon508 (talk) 00:24, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

Relics and universal rules

So then we got into a topic about how the allies matrix should work or at least started work on it. Another topic that should be brought up is possible universal rules that all members of the codex have along with relics.

Relic wise there should be a few relics that any of the races can take then a couple race specific relics in one section. So something like this for a race specific one

Taros Banner (Gue'Vesa): Made to mark the great victory that the Tau Empire had over the Imperium, the Tau Etheral caste had this made and given to the Gue'vesa who fought in this conflict. Since then the Banner has passed from Hunter cadre to hunter cadre with a strong Gue'vesa force, adding to the victories that it has earned. Lets every unit within 12" re-roll failed leadership tests.

So a format of Relic name (Race) for the relics.

Rules wise we may want to give a universal rule of Auxiliary to every unit. An idea I have is a group unit that you can take if you have taken multiple races as a sort of council of units. So say your hunter cadre has Ranghan, Tallarian, and guevesa. You can take a small seers council like force made up of those three members. There job is to through buffs around for your units.

Merc races like the Tallarian would have this rule unless they take a paymaster which changes the rule to Mercs and gives a different benefit.

All of this is very rough so does need work.Dragoon508 (talk) 07:14, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

Enemies of Tarell Perish (Tarellian) The last scripture of Dras'Esla, one of the first desert priests, this scripture tells all Tarellains to let no wrongs against their people go unpunished, driving all who hear it to a cold fury, wishing for nothing more than revenge for their fallen brethren. All Tarellians will hit Space Marines, Imperial Guards, Sister's of Battle, and Tyranids on a 3+ in Close Combat. (This sort of thing?) Groggarioth talk March 22nd 00:30 (UK)

Yea pretty much. However probably need to nerf that a bit, maybe make it within 12" for it to be effective. Dragoon508 (talk) 03:24, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

Galg

So if I ever run a Galg force I shall model them like swampmen/Caujins. Have them speak in accents and probably other stereotypical stuff. As a warning.

I am also thinking of making a kind of a joke HQ for them as well. Give him a special weapon called The Boom Stick. Basically in the same vein of my other joke HQ Pulso the first Ji'atrix Shas'O, who is just a parody of Blasto from Mass effec.

Do remember they are fairly frog like, other than that, stick up some pics for the gallery once you model them, pretty please.

Not a good modeler I am afraid and a notroucious painter since I shake a bit to much to have a steady hand, so not something I would ever do. But my idea was to use some tau bits and bits from the gatormen from hordes. Then there is some minis out there with a voddoo theme as well. So I could get the wide brimmed hats like so [18].

Galg Heavy Pistol

Introducing one of the last few Galg weapons, the Heavy Burst Pistol, the basic Pistol comes with just the Regular Rounds, but some units can upgrade to the HEI/AP Rounds, and the Basic HQ I'm working on/Nemeroth's & Swamp Sleuths will be able to grab the One Use underslung Grenade as a last resort defensive weapon. Alongside a "Relic" Version (If anyone's wondering where I get the Pistol 1 thing from, it's just a habit I picked up), what do you guys (Dragoon, Evilexecutive, & BobVI) think for points cost and unit placement The Greater Meh (talk) 19:52, 19 September 2015 (UTC)

Well burst implies multiple shots, so may want to make the regular rounds go for pistol 2 or something. Other than that it looks decentDragoon508 (talk) 00:25, 20 September 2015 (UTC)

Added some points costs that I think might fit The Greater Meh (talk) 14:04, 20 September 2015 (UTC)

Name	Range	S	AP	Type	Theoretical Points Cost
Heavy Burst Pistol	-	-	-	---
Regular Rounds	6"	4	-	Pistol 1	1 Point
HEI/AP Rounds	6"	6	4	Pistol 1, Rending, Pinning, Gets Hot!	+10 Points
Underslung EX-HEAT Grenade	6"	7	3	Heavy 1, Large Blast, One Use only	+5 Points
Swamp Rose	12"	6	4	Pistol 1, Rending, Pinning, Master-Crafted	20 Points (Includes a single EX-Heat Grenade)

Experienced Galg mercenaries often find that while their Thump Guns are excellent weapons for fighting against foes in the open, they are often as dangerous to their wielder as to any enemy when in a cramped environment or any structure, and while they do carry the Machetes they use for clearing out swamp & jungle environments as a weapon for use in close quarters combat they are often outmatched by their opponents.

Enter the Burst Pistol, essentially a heavily modified Stub-Revolver, designed for use in the claustrophobic environments where the use of the Galgs usual weaponry is ill advised. The Burst Pistol is built from the same template as the Heavy “Rotator”, which allows it to use the same HEI/AP ammunition with a lower payload so that the explosion can still present a threat to an opponent while not having the risk of collapsing the structure that the wielder is inside.

Some Burst Pistols come with an underslung Grenade launcher, made to hold a single EX-HEAT Round to allow the wielder at least some defence against heavy armour when they run out of ammunition for their other weapons, but the design is uncommon and significantly cuts down on the Burst Pistols capacity.

[[19]] Where I grabbed the idea from

Issues with Galg

Galg mercinary Clutch/Sworn Troopers: You can trade Blast pining weapon for +6" range, AP5, &deff grenades for +2points/model... this seems a bit off. Especially when you can get a +1ws&+1S unit for 11ppm with the pulse rifle base. I mean, you can't get deff grenades that way, but no one really cares.

The Galg Swamp Sleuth Clutch is 60 points for 3 models. But you can buy more for 12 points/model. Is this supposed to be a 36 point base unit(for shrouded pathfinders I don't think so), or supposed to be 20 points/model?

yeah, it's supposed to be 5 Models base, also, what's wrong with Shrouded, they have worse Armour, a Worse weapon, lack of Pinning, and worse/less options The Greater Meh (talk) 00:10, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

Galg Mobile Battery has no options. This is sad.

The points cost will most likely be dropped down when we get some play tests in. Groggarioth has admited he just throws numbers out to see what sticks so we can drop them down later. I think we are looking at a 9 or 10 point unit, but they have not been playtested so not sure on that regard.

Yeah, going to admit, I mostly just work on things when I have the idea's in my head, as it stands I've been working on the Pakasar, and a bunch of buildings. The Greater Meh (talk) 22:02, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

The mobile battery will probably get some more options later on. Got to remember that we are not even close to being done with this codex and stuff is changing all the time.Dragoon508 (talk) 18:51, 29 August 2015 (UTC)

So highly overcosted as to be not worth it in the slightest. I've done some work to fix that using FAXIV, but seriously? Whoever designed the race had no clue at all how to apply stats to things. They're a bunch of variations of Conscript Equivalents, and Guardsman Equivalents, mostly dedicated melee(Which amuses me because of their shit stats)Evilexecutive (talk) 00:52, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

Somewhere, somehow, somewhen the stats got muddled up from what I originally had in the Word Doc, they should be WS & S 3 across the race, with the Demolisher dropping WS by 1 to increase BS by 1, and "dedicated melee" cease thine jests kind sir, they're supossed to be an explosives focussed force that covers a large area from close range, with Tau supporting fire at their backs, they've got Machetes because they are at such close range that melee combat is inevitable, but they want to avoid it if at all possible -Groggarioth- (all your hate is applied to me)

Nagi

I am not comfortable with making an ethereal into a Psyker with a Nagi upgrade like that. The rule seems a bit off to me as well.

This is what I was working on for the Nagi.

Nagi Advisor: An upgrade for an ethereal that can be taken for 30 pts. The Etheral may make all deny the witch rolls at 3+ and grants the ethereal admatine will.

Just the psyker thing is what bugs me the most about this is all.

• You wanted to make something with a 2+ Deny the Witch? For 30 points? That's ridiculously overpowered for all of the powers that target you and not any of the extremely powerful ones that you can't easily deal with like invisibility, why not take something that makes it harder to pass warp charge tests like rolling two dice for each warp charge and pick the lowest, or inflicting a -1 modifier to rolls passing a successful Ld test? -- Triacom (talk) 14:52, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

I like the Deny thing, according to the Fluff, Ethereal's should be able to do that anyway (Fire Warrior, an Ethereal resists Greater Daemonic Possession purely through spiritual balance), but maybe give them Adamantium will, and 1 lvl of psyker mastery, but no powers, (so it has to be spent on denial) at 40 points -groggarioth-

• Denying isn't a bad idea, making them able to resist Psychic abilities far better than other beings like Primarchs, not to mention making them virtually invincible to Psychic attacks? That's what I'm against. Psychic attacks are not anywhere close to daemonic possession, so why would an Etheral be nearly invincible to them? -- Triacom (talk) 19:34, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

They have virtually no Warp presence, as far as I understand, (I'm not too familiar with Psykers, fluff-wise or rules-wise) the less Warp-presence you have the more resistant you are to Warp based powers and effect culminating with Blanks who have no Warp Presence, but are completely immune to Warp related shenanigans, and shut down other nearby psykers (Nearby meaning about 50 metres depending on the Blank), while the Tau are not flat-out Blanks, they still have a low, low, low Warp Presence to the point that I think the only person able to perform any warp related shenanigans with a Tau mind was Khorne (and even then it was an angry fucking Tau, (Fire Warrior Novel)), so having a Psyker nearby, actually concentrating on shutting down other Psychic powers, it might make for a fairly decent shut-down. -Groggarioth-

Yea this is probably too op. I think probably the best is to give them a 4+ deny the witch roll and probably the admatine will. I would price it more along 50 points instead. I still do not like the thought of an etheral running around with warp powers even if it is technically another model casting it.Dragoon508 (talk) 00:09, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

• Blanks and true Pariahs don't shut down Psykers, they just make it very hard for the Psyker to use their abilities when they're close by (this is on the tabletop anyway), even Celexus Assassins only make it extremely hard for Psykers to use their abilities, and they are the ones with zero warp presence (true Pariahs), Blanks still have a warp presence even if it is very small (far smaller than your generic Tau) which is what allows them to live amongst other people, whereas when confronted with a true Pariah people cannot help but feel the urge to get as far away from them as possible to the point that they'll try to kill them on the spot just so they won't have to be near them any more. As far as rules go though I think it would be just fine to bring in some old Witch Hunters rules, they're a separate model that provides a 4+ Deny the Witch save, and two of them provide a 2+ DtW save (though they can be targeted separately and killed). The only difference is that in Witch Hunters they took up retinue space, which was kind of a valuable commodity, and I'm not sure it could be factored in here, but maybe that doesn't need to be. -- Triacom (talk) 03:19, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

Maybe have it give a flat out 4+ Deny the witch roll for 10pts. The old witch hunters codex has them costed at 7 pts. Maybe we could boost the Nagi advisor up to 25 pts and let the ethereal reroll failed leadership tests as well? Make it seem that the Nagi advisor gave him new advise or some shit.Dragoon508 (talk) 05:16, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

• The reason they were priced at 7 pts in the Witch Hunters codex was because they were effectively useless outside of Denying the Witch, they were an obvious target (and therefore needed to be protected) and they took up valuable Retinue space (two of those three downsides do not come into play here). Keeping them as an upgrade that cannot be targeted just seems odd to me, but not as much as an Etheral that gets any sort of Psyker powers, advisor upgrade or not. Here's another thought, why not give them Adamantium Will and allow both them and the Etheral to roll for DtW? You'd keep them both separate for fluff reasons while in practice still giving yourself a 4+ DtW. -- Triacom (talk) 05:44, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

• Hang on a minute, the Nagi currently allows the Etheral to choose its powers? Why does it do that exactly instead of rolling for them? I'm not for having a Psychic Etheral, but one that can choose Invisibility every single time is BLATANTLY overpowered. -- Triacom (talk) 05:46, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

Yea I did not add that nagi one, someone else did that was not Groggarioth or I. So it is a bit too over powered I think. The Nagi I always thought were really tiny so it is why I am not doing them separate in my thing.

NAgi Advisor: An upgrade for 30 points, grants deny the witch rolls at 4+ and adamantium will.Dragoon508 (talk) 06:16, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

Sorry about the choosing your powers part. That was an accident due to not considering my wording.--Ilniaj (talk) 00:10, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

Put it in Groggarioth (talk) 16:59, 24 March 2015 (UTC)

Available to all

We may have created the ultimate Psyker Killer by making the Mindworm more freely available, if a Desert Priest with a Nagi Mindworm manages to roll Heart of the Desert for his Warlord Trait, would it become functionally impossible to succeed on Psychic Powers? The Greater Meh (talk) 14:19, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Who made it avalible to all? It was just supposed to be for etherealsDragoon508 (talk) 14:36, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

That would be me unfortunately. I thought it was upsurd to have an upgrade in one codex that's meant for another codex but can't be used in that codex. But now I see that it's kinda broken to just say "All HQ Choices in Tau Auxiliary". Would it work better to have that as an "Upgrade for Ethereals(Codex: Tau Empire) and Authorized Models in Codex: Tau Auxiliary"?Evilexecutive (talk) 16:34, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

I would honestly say just keep it with etherals, as it was always ment as an ethereal only thing. A lot of the races bring anti-psyker stuff in one form or another, while the tau themselves dont really, it was meant to give the main tau codex some anti-psyker power. Another note is that the tau auxiliary codex counts as being a part of the tau empire codex, and is only a separate codex when no tau stuff is taken.So basically it does not coun't as an allied detachmentDragoon508 (talk) 16:58, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Well the thing is RAW it's not a single model that makes the Deny roll, but rather the entire unit, with modifiers based on any models in the unit making the roll, so if we were to put an Ethereal with a Mind Worm into the same unit as a Desert Priest, they would make their DtW at 3+, as the unit has both the Mind Worm, and the Adamantium Will USR, it gets worse if we add in a ML3 Nicassar Captain into the mix, as then the unit contains a Psyker (+1) for a DtW of 2+, and if the Captain is a higher ML than the opponent Psyker (Not unlikely at ML3), then that's another +1, making for a Deny the Witch roll of 1+!!!, at the cost of about 230 points (254 for a pair of Shield Drones) which is scary considering that much like the Smashfucker FnP Build, DtW doesn't auto-fail on a roll of 1, and could be done even if only the Ethereal had access to the Nagi Mind Worm, and none of those guys are Unique characters meaning you can have multiple of these "You obey the laws of Physics and you like it" squads running around, granted only 1 might have the ability to cause enemy Psykers to choke on their own powers though -Groggarioth-

Auxiliaries and Council

I put up rules for both Auxiliaries, and the Council of the Many, what do you guys think? Groggarioth (talk) 23:50, 25 March 2015 (UTC)

Only complant at the moment is that if you have it like that you could end up with like 5 seperate HQs although if you are playing unbound anyways then that is fine.Dragoon508 (talk) 07:39, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

Really, I made sure to try and avoid that by saying that the council did not take up an FOC Slot, or do I need to word it differently, also I dislike how putting 4 of these things together (~) turns me into "The Greater Meh" The Greater Meh (talk) 16:10, 28 March 2015 (UTC)

Altered the Auxiliaries rule, so that they could use Markerlight tokens, other wise the rules in the Tau Codex say that only Tau Codex units can se MArkerlight Tokens The Greater Meh (talk) 19:29, 29 March 2015 (UTC)

For the council of many should the formosian pod breeder give out dug in or unstable concations instead? I am thinking stick with dug in even if the image of an unit suddenly growing arms like the formosians gives me chucklesDragoon508 (talk) 02:43, 11 September 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, let's stick with just "Dug In", although *Mind drifts to how hard a commissar's mind would break when he sees Gue'Vesa walking around with 2 extra Arms, chatting like it's a normal day at the office* The Greater Meh (talk) 16:55, 11 September 2015 (UTC)

N'Deemi

Sorry the N'Deemi are taking so long, I'm working on how to approach them and I've only recently got a really good idea, how's this for a special rule (modified version of Blind)

Obscure: Any unit hit by a model or weapon with this special rule must immediately take an Initiative test. If the test is passed, all is well - a shouted warning has caused the warriors to avert their gaze. If the Initiative test is failed, all models in the unit are reduced to Weapon Skill and Ballistic Skill I until the end of their next turn. Should the attacking unit hit themselves) we assume they are prepared and they automatically pass the test. A Unit with the “Night Vision” USR automatically passes the Initiative test.

The Greater Meh (talk) 15:48, 4 April 2015 (UTC)

Giving them different types of armour is kind of pointless is it not? The save is already displayed on their profile and all the different types simply give Shrouded, which might as well be included in the unit´s special rules instead of making rules for their armour. Also as an added question, who and what are the N´Deemi? It would be nice if there was a short description of their appearance. I would also suggest making models with Night Fighting ignore Obscure, rather than just automatically pass the test, otherwise it would still have an effect on a unit which got Night Fighting after taking the test. The Obscure rule might actually have to be changed entirely, while the N´Deemi do have low leadership, if you put a Priest in them, they can act not only almost indestructible at range, but they also provide a Blind test every turn. Against Tau battlesuits of various sizes and Necrons this is entirely devastating, against Eldar Wraiths and Space Marines it is meh at best and then it is useless against Dark Eldar. The race is very vulnerable to both Barrage and Ignores Cover weaponry. I think the race, but especially the troops, are very much win or lose. They will rarely be okay. I think Shrouded should be downgraded to Stealth and Obscure might give anything they shoot at Stealth (like what Night Fighting does). The Obscure rule might have an added clause giving models which already have Stealth the Shrouded rule in addition to the Stealth special rule. You could then improve the units firepower or points cost. I don´t necessarily think they are unbalanced, just very gimmicky and one-trick-pony like. Angry Pirate (talk) 16:26, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

I'm not entirely sure what you're trying to say here, I understand the point about the interactions with Night Vision & Obscure, but I'm not quite sure what you mean with your suggested change, something like this Obscure Whenever a model is hit with a successful attack by a weapon with this special rule it treats all enemy models as having the Stealth USR/ all enemy models treat their cover saves as 1 higher for the purposes of this units shooting attacks, Units with Night Vision ignore this Special Rule. Something like this? Also, all Tau Battlesuits have Night Vision built in, they ignore the Night Fighting rules thanks to Blacksun Filters.

As for the weakness to Ignores Cover/Barrage weapons, that's intentional, I've tried to make sure each Species/Faction has a weakness somewhere in their design/playstyle that another race in the Auxiliary 'Dex can compensate for, the problem here being that there really is no way to counteract this weakness, beyond giving someone the ability to negate Ignores Cover, and that's a rabbit hole I'd rather not go down, however think on it, argue with me some more, and hopefully we should be able to thrash something out to improve them. I'm mostly reliant on other people's feedback to perfect this 'Dex, as the many, many point cost debates will show, also working on a transport for them, but college course comes first.

Lastly the fluff, working on it, I'm not great at the fluff, and their appearance is deliberately left up in the air, beyond being naturally horrific, as they suffer from being very, very minor blanks, as Unsettling Presence shows, everyone, and everything finds Blanks naturally unsettling, and in the case of the N'Deemi, that means their appearance is somewhat nebulous, always changing slightly depending on who is looking at them The Greater Meh (talk) 17:25, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

My Idea was:

Obscure: Any unit hit by one or more models or weapons with this special rule count all enemy units as having the Stealth special rule until the start of your next shooting phase, any unit which already has the Stealth special rule also counts as having the Shrouded special rule. Units with the Night Fighting special rule ignore the Obscure special rule.

Of course that would only work for ranged and it´s only really the Troops where it matters.

As far as what I meant. They are very good in certain situations and very bad in other situations. I don´t think this is a good idea for a Troops choice. If you changed the Obscure special rule (only for the ranged weapons) to what I outlined above and gave (at least the Troops) Stealth instead of Shrouded then they wouldn´t be awesome in some games and punishingly bad in others, something which I think fits more with the Elites, Fast and Heavy Support choices.

Here is what I meant by the armour bit is superfluous, you can just remove the Shadow Armour part and then give the unit the Shrouded (or Stealth) special rule. Of course this wouldn´t represent the armour giving the warriors a shroud of darkness if that was what you are going for rather than them simply possessing it naturally.

Name	WS	BS	S	T	W	I	A	Ld	Sv
Shadow Warrior	2	3	3	3	1	3	1	5	6+
Shadow Leader	2	3	3	3	1	3	2	6	6+

Unit Type: Infantry (Shadow Leader is a character)

Unit Composition: 10 Shadows Warriors

Wargear: Obscura Rifle

Special Rules: Night Vision, Shrouded

Options:

The part about fluff was dumb on my part, I should have noticed it was still in production and you simply had not gotten around to it. I do find it rather humorous that a race with the Fear special rule has leadership 5 base, kind of like how people are afraid of even harmless species of spiders and bugs. Angry Pirate (talk) 18:43, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

You've picked up on a couple of the fluff things I was working on, yeah the N'Deemi are fairly reclusive, they try to avoid other races/faction because others usually react badly to them due to the Blanks thing, The Tau actually conquered militarily due to the feelings of paranoia that they cause rather than the more usual diplomatic process, also yeah, the Armour does wrap them in shadows, they use negative energy weapons which is where the Obscura weapons work, they (and this is complete scientific bullshit, but hey-ho) collect and fire negative energy in a focused "glob" which freezes and obscures at the same time, the armour is made with the same principles in mind except it emits a strange photonic cancellation field, that combined with the fact they're naturally hard to look at, gives them their access to the Shrouded USR, and is why the Shroud of Flames reduces their cover saves because it gives a much more solid target, a ball of light rather than a teeming nondescript mass of shadows. It's a combination of sources, and could go either way, but the Ji'Atrix already had Shrouded as a natural rule so I wanted to do it differently here in the name of variety. If you're having trouble of visualising what this looks like, picture the Balrog from Lord of the Rings without any fire, just shadows. The Greater Meh (talk) 20:48, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

Consistency>false variety. Putting the rule on the unit would make it easier to follow. --Bobthe6th (talk) 19:10, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

That's a fair point, sometimes (a lot of times) I tend to get wrapped up in looking for synonyms & homonyms, it also helps a bit with vehicle designs I'm still throwing at them, don't expect anything to be done until Feb though, I'm finishing up on a college course The Greater Meh (talk) 23:46, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Formations

Gonna start work on formations for each race within the week The Greater Meh (talk) 00:07, 12 May 2015 (UTC)

For the elysian skyguard you may want to drop the name elysian since that is basically imperial only. Also may want to include valkyrie picies to that listDragoon508 (talk) 20:20, 9 September 2015 (UTC)

I never thought there might be a reason to take jump sentinels. This formation seems like it might break them. --Bobthe6th (talk) 19:42, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

No, AV10 walkers are shit-units normally, considering that they're essentially Toughness 6 units that have no armour save, and can be stunlocked. Most people never take sentinels for a pretty good reason, so having a formation that makes them useful(Namely just drone spam) is a great way to convince people to buy and use sentinels. It's a win for us, and a win for GW if people start using them.Evilexecutive (talk) 19:56, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Seems is the operative word there. Needs play testing, in all honesty. It seems like they will alpha and then explode, but on the other hand not even a drop pod list can generally put that many models directly into the opponents side of the board. --Bobthe6th (talk) 20:18, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Galg Formation below, could someone tell me what they think please The Greater Meh (talk) 20:57, 11 September 2015 (UTC)

I like itDragoon508 (talk) 21:11, 11 September 2015 (UTC)

Only way to take Demolition teams. Adds some alpha strike, which is great against the current meta. On the other hand turn zero hits are sorta iffy at best.

Galg Demolition Team: 1-3 Galg Wrecker Clutches, May include Bokrug the Demolisher.

Benefits: All units in this Formation gain the Infiltrate USR, but must deploy within 12" of each other. After these units are placed choose a single enemy Vehicle or Building within 36" of at least one of these units, that Vehicle or Building suffers a number of S:8, AP2, Armourbane hits equal to the number of units purchased in this formation.

Hows this for a Morrallian formation. --Bobthe6th (talk) 18:02, 21 December 2015 (UTC)

Murder Close Air Support: 2-4 Morrallian Raven Gunship, 1-2 Morrallian Morrigan Gunship.

Benefits:Units in this formation get +1 to their reserve rolls and stealth.

's good, but I'd replace Stealth with all Raven's gain the Strafing Run USR and Morrigan's gain the Tank Hunter USR. Give the flavour of Close Air Support, designed to deal with certain types of enemy threats The Greater Meh (talk) 20:32, 21 December 2015 (UTC)

Additionally a group of Ravens is called a Conspiracy or an Unkindness, a group of Crows is called a Murder, so name change The Greater Meh (talk) 15:37, 22 December 2015 (UTC)

Kor units

Got to say while the Kor speeders look like an interesting idea, it is a better fit for a fire warrior unit or a different race. Since the Kor fly everything and seems like it is intruding onto fire warrior territory.Dragoon508 (talk) 20:07, 17 June 2015 (UTC)

they're also noted to be couriers, and messengers, and in a setting as big as the 40K galaxy, even the small slot that the Tau inhabit, there could well be something that keeps them from taking to the air, plus it always seemed to me that the Fire Caste have their ritual hunts, why wouldn't the Air caste have ritual races, or flight competitions, plus those speeder bikes would make for easier planet transport, seeing as the Air caste primarily live in space stations, and can't handle planet gravity that well anymore. The Greater Meh (talk) 22:33, 18 June 2015 (UTC)

I am going to concede because that is an extremely good point that I did not think of. Then my only thought would be the stat line of 3 T. Probably should drop that down to 2 to reflect their weaker bone structure. I think some fluff points to their bones being hollow but not 100% sure Dragoon508 (talk) 23:28, 18 June 2015 (UTC)

They do have a Toughness of 2, any unit that gains a Bike or Jetbike improves its Toughness by +1, so I've got that put into their statline as standard Also yeah their bones are probably hollow, they did originally have wings (or gliding membranes at the least). The Greater Meh (talk) 00:44, 19 June 2015 (UTC)

Warlord traits

I kind of see a problem with traits 3, 4, and 6. In the fact that it could give a point advantage to a person running them as well as messing up a list structure. For instance giving a unit combat armour, pulse rifles, and a markerlight is basically giving a unit almost 30 free points of equipment if we go off of trait 3. trait 4 would basically give you about 20 free points on average to an HQ, although the equipment could just not be worthwhile to your warlord and it would be a wasted roll.

Traits 1,2,5 could be kept with them being in the 1,2,3 order. Then each race would have their own 4,5,6 like how it is with the inquisition codex between the different ordos.Dragoon508 (talk) 07:54, 19 June 2015 (UTC)

Major Update to the Warlord Traits, following the above idea, could you please tell me what you guys think? The Greater Meh (talk) 17:40, 25 June 2015 (UTC)

Only suggestion is that you switch the morellion 3 trait to 6, as that seems to be the best of the three. Other than that they look good.Dragoon508 (talk) 00:43, 26 June 2015 (UTC)

Playtests

Has anyone done any playtests for the Auxiliary yet? if so then tell us what you think, I am thinking I will put together a vassal game with about 500 points of units to play with when I get the chance.Dragoon508 (talk) 01:47, 21 June 2015 (UTC)

Send me an email to Evilexecutive@gmail.com; or add me on skype from Hellfire585, I'd be happy to do some playtests with ya over Vassal anytime next week. Either Standard Space marines, or Knights Inductor(Which doesn't do well in lower point games unfortunately). I won't be available tomorrow or any sunday, as I DM pathfinder and play warhammer on that day.Evilexecutive (talk) 01:54, 21 June 2015 (UTC)

Solves that problem then. I think against the space marines first would be for the best, I am going to post the list I made up for the match here now so others can comment on it. I wanted to do a mix of tau units with some auxilarry supporting them with this list as a startDragoon508 (talk) 02:21, 21 June 2015 (UTC)

Damnit, don't post your list where I can see it, now it's unfair for both of us. Evilexecutive (talk) 02:27, 21 June 2015 (UTC)

So both of the playtests finished and got to say. Did not end up so good for the Tau.

So, what are we using for tiles of the Auxiliaries? The Greater Meh (talk) 20:41, 2 July 2015 (UTC)

500 point test list

Tau commander, burst cannon, flamer advanced targeting system

12 man fire warrior team Markerlight and target lock

Gue'Vesa 72 points Markerlight 5 pulse carbines

10x Sisters of Ash

Tau Crisis suit busts cannon, flamer, advanced targeting system

500 Points Vanilla Space Marines 3-model Dreadnought Squad, Single TL-Autocannon

8 Scout Marines, Camo cloaks, Sniper Rifles, 1 heavy bolter Techmarine

This list did not do so well because of a lack of anti armor against the dreadnoughts. Only was able to shoot at them without effect. Found that the sisters of Ash are in dire need of a transport option. Combined with the lack of forest terrain hampered their effectivness to nothing. They are a good assualt unit however but may need a bit more work. The Gue'vesa are basically guards with a bit more tech. Nothing fancy there. Probably needs to be in a list with Gue'Vesa HQs so they can get the benifits of the Voice of the Gue'vesa rule.

Well, it didn't do so well mostly because I brought my "500 point trolling list", which takes a huge advantage of people's unhealthy tendency to not bring Anti-Armor and Ignores Cover(The scouts had all 2+ saves). I'll admit that this isn't a battle that's good for demonstrating what the codex can do.

1850 point list

HQ: Tau Commander Plasma rifle, missile pod, flamer, shield generator shield drone, marker drone HQ:2x Bodyguard crisis burst cannon, flamer, bonding knife Fusion blaster

HQ: Boreal Shaman mastery 2, stranglevine grenades

Elite: 5x Gue'vesa strike team EMP grenades, 2x rail rifle dedicated transport: Sawfish fusion blaster

troop: 12x fire warrior team markerlight and target lock dedicated transport: Devilfish 2x seeker troop: 12x fire warrior team markerlight and target lock dedicated transport: Devilfish 2x seeker Troop: 10x Glade guard 4x rail caster Troop: 16 Deathsworn 2x flamer

Heavy support: 3x Broadside battlesuits Shas'vre, 2x shield drones, multi missle, velocity tracker

Heavy Support: 5x Anthrazod shock troops 2x plasma rifle

1850 Points, Yo Dawg I herd you Liek Razorbacks, Vanilla Space Marines

Battle Demi Company: Captain, 3 Tactical Squads(1 Flamer each), 1 Assault Squad(1 flamer each), 1 Devastator Squad(4 Lascannons)

Battle Demi Company: Chaplain, 3 Tactical Squads(1 Flamer each), 1 Assault Squad(1 flamer each), 1 Devastator Squad(4 Lascannons)

Reclusiarch Command Squad Barebones Command squad with Apothecary and Chaplain

10 Free Razorbacks, each one upgraded with a Hunter Killer Missile.

3-model Whirlwind squad

3-model Dreadnought Squad, 1 TL-Autocannon each.

Fought a very mech heavy list with this one. Was able to do a bit of damage to the razorbacks that were brought in, but their squads not so much. The Ranghon were really good, however they got pounded to death by whirlwinds after three turns. As with the sisters of Ash they could benifit from a transport option, however they sat in cover all game plinking away at hull points. The boreal shaman added interesting powers to the mix and with a bit of tweaking to the power list it will perform well. Deathsworn are simply over costed at 14 points a model, that is as much as a space marine for a model that is basically like a guard unit. It does have pulse rifles which are good but probably needs to get dropped to about 7 or 8 points a model, in addition to a transport model for a dedicated transport.

The shocktroopers did alright but fell to weight of fire by turn 2 after taking out a single razorback. They did act as a good distraction for a turn to let my broadsides do some damage, although since they were in the way of line of sight they actually made my broadsides miss their first shots. The Gue'vesa strike team did pretty well for themselves along with the sawfish. Would have been better in a Valkyrie to be honest but overall they did decently. They probably need to get a melta option although if they had been closer to the whirlwind I would have used emp grenades to a big effect. The Sawfish performed as expected as a surgical strike vehicle. Even survived some fire because of the shield generator. Overall the Gue'Vesa seem to not be lacking in transport options.

The main problem this round was my bad rolls. If I had rolled better I probably could have won a few more kill points. This was really apparent with how bad my broadsides did, only wracking up two kills in their 3 turns of life. Evil should be posting his lists later on and his thoughts on the battle.Dragoon508 (talk) 23:40, 26 June 2015 (UTC)

I was the guy dropping in and out of your battle while you guys were playing. I'll note one thing: the full Battle Company with free Razorbacks is pretty unfair to fight against unless you're playing a super optimized OP army. Had it been a more toned down reasonable force than you'd probably have better data to go off of. I mean, sure what Evil played is probably one of the new competitive SM lists but it's literally 500+ points free models, so it it's an inherently imbalanced game. I wouldn't put too much weight on it and I certainly wouldn't be buffing things sky high just because you lost against this kind of list. The only thing I'd play that kind of list against is someone who I know is cheese-mongering with Screamer/Seer-star and the like. Remoon101 (talk) 00:05, 27 June 2015 (UTC)

1500 Points, Tau Auxiliary Vs. Space Marines

HQ: Ranghon Lord 85 points MC power sword

HQ: Brotherhood Elder 117 points 2x shield drones, emp grenades

Elite: 10x Sisters of Ash 145 points stanglevine grenades MC ashblade

Transport: Spider Walker 90 points twin-linked rail caster stranglevine launcher

Troops: 10x Glade Guard 150 points four rail casters

Transport: Spider Walker 80 points twin-linked rail caster

Troops: 10x Glade Guard 150 points four rail casters

Transport: Spider Walker 80 points twin-linked rail caster

Heavy Support: Conductor Balista 100 points

Heavy Support: 3x Bombardier 300 points

Fast Attack:3x IronBreaker light tank 195 points

Space Marines: Unbound 1500

HQ

Terminator Captain, Power Axe: 120

Troops

7 Scout Marines, Camo Cloaks, Sniper Rifles: 98

Elites

Sternguard Veterans, Combi-Meltas, Drop Pod: 195

Fast Attack

Stormtalon Gunship, Missiles: 130

Stormtalon Gunship, Missiles: 130

Heavy Support

Devastator Squad, 2 Gravcannons-Gravamps, Rhino: 175

Devastator Squad, 2 Gravcannons-Gravamps, Rhino: 175

Devastator Squad, 2 Gravcannons-Gravamps, Rhino: 175

Thunderfire Cannon: 100

Whelp another loss for the auxiliary. This time I decided to not take the Tau as a main force and instead only have units in the codex. With purge the alien as the mission type, I had 3 KP to evils 7 with almost a 4th kp against his techmarine. Bad rolls were a big problem for me with the bombardiers and ironbreakers. The bombardiers got taken out by a deep striking sternguard unit but took out one of them when one of the bombardiers exploded. Unfortunately that is basically all they did this game.

The conductor did took some HP off a rhino but that was about it. It will probably work better in an anti horde list which is what I designed it for in the first place. Going to put in a skyfire option for them however. Glade guard did decently well with popping a couple of rhino's Railcasters are pretty good in this regard and are extremely useful. The bowcasters were helpful as well for that mater. They do need to get infiltrate and this is something that will be going across the board with Ranghon, with a small price increase to reflect this. Sisters performed wonderfully and don't really need any more balance. They did their job as a dedicated assault unit. Piercing song is extremely useful. I need to define what type of grenade the stranglevine grenades are however. The spider walkers were fun and helped with taking off HP from the rhinos but two of them got destroyed by turn 1.

The brotherhood elder and the warriors will probably lose the EMP grenade option because they already have a melta weapon as standard. Dragoon508 (talk) 19:56, 1 July 2015 (UTC)

This game was another one done against a highly competitive list. I really should start holding back against these guys a little. Nowhere near as much cheese as the previous list, but here I used a ton of Grav-rhinos to shit out 30 AP2 shots a turn, and I would have brought 2 more without hesitation in 1850 if I was doing competitive. Anyway I think that the direction we should be going with the Ranghon is Alpha Strike, Sneeki Breeki units. While not competitive it's a great and fun idea in casual games

As for Demiurge, keep going the way of Spammable light tanks. If you want to really compete with them, Iron Tanks are the way to go, but support them with some more hard hitters wherever possible, and keep some spammable troops to camp objectives.Evilexecutive (talk) 05:29, 2 July 2015 (UTC)

1000 Points Tau Auxiliary vs Thousand Sons

Auxiliary army: HQ

Hrenian Storm Commander (90) ((Attached to Hrenian Storm Troopers))

(Warlord) So-Spada, Master of the Trackless Wastes (180)

Troops

N’Deemi Shadow Warriors (70) + 5 Additional Models (35) Total (105)

N’Deemi Shadow Warriors (70) + 5 Additional Models (35) Total (105)

Elites

Hrenian Storm Trooper Squad (142)

Fast Attack

Pathfinders (44) +2 Models (22) + Pulse Accelerator Drone (15 Points) + Shas’Ui (10) + Blacksun filter (1) Total (92)

Pathfinders (44) +2 Models (22) + Pulse Accelerator Drone (15 Points) + Shas’Ui (10) Total (91)

Heavy Support

Tarellian Thunder Walker Shock Trooper (80) + 1 Model (80) + Thunder Walker Hatch Leader (10) + Tarellian Dragon Hammer (25) Total (195)

Overall Total – 1000

TS army

Sorc Lord with ML3, book of Magnus, disk (270 pts)

Sorcerer squad (3) with disks and Mirror WoP (210 pts)

Rubric Golem Sons squad (5) with HB and Rhino (216 pts)

Young Sons squad (9) with Practicus. (150 pts)

Terrorfiend (150 pts)

996 pts total, total mastery level 9

To save the time, on the first turn sorcerers killed like 20% of both Shadow Warriors squads, frenzied one and false commanded one back, enfeebled and then pressed down Thunder Walker squad. Pathfinders tried to kill a Rhino that pressed forward but failed, So-Spada sniped Practicus accros the board. At turn two sorcs enfeebled Thunder Walkers to T2, and young sons instakilled one of them with bolters (second one was out of range) once again frenzied one shadow warrior squad and set a fire wall in front of them so they would run though it next turn, Terrorfiend fired at remaining thunder walker but failed to do anyrhing. Rubric golem squad disembarks from their Rhino and rapidfires most of one of the pathfindes squad down, remaining shas'ui and his drone run away. Storm troopers deep-strike behind TS lines and scatter out of the board. At this point auxiliary surrenders. Mezmerro (talk) 20:13, 4 July 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, went real bad real quick on my end, but more due to bad rolls and poor unit choices, than any real unit point imbalance so I might increase the N'deemi's Ld by a point, but that's about it, probably should have brought some Nicassar, Desert Priests, or Ethereals with Nagi Mind worms for denial

On my part I must say things got Just As Planned. This list was designed as super glass cannon, only survival of which comes from stun locking enemy army and hiding out of LoS. It went out brilliantly, with only one model of casualties. Sure, that deep strikers scattering off the board was a huge luck of mine. They had a potential to wipe half of my sorcerer squad. Mezmerro (talk) 08:34, 5 July 2015 (UTC)

2500 Points: Tau Auxiliary Vs. Tau Auxiliary. Evilexecutive and Dragoon

It's a goddamn hellmarch, like a swarm of indestructible bees about to hit some unsuspecting victim

Map: A Forest Planet taking place on the world of Tanith. This map consisted of 6 "Nalwood" Clusters that provided 4+ cover with a twist. At the start of each turn after the first, 2d6 Scatter is rolled. All Nalwoods on the map move that distance. Aside from the nalwoods, a 5+ area terrain "Firebase" made up the center, and surrounding it was some various small rocks, watchtowers, and Non-Difficult/Dangerous Shrubbery that provided 6+ cover.

Here's a first in Fandex Testing, a Fandex being pitted against itself for the sake of internal balancing.

Evilexecutive's Army: Unbound so I can ignore FOG Restrictions. 249 Models in Total

• 8 Strike Teams

• 4 with 2 Plasma Guns
• 4 with 2 flamers

• 2 6-man Gue'Va'sa Sniper Teams

• 1 Markerlight Each

• 120 Gue'va'saal(The 4++ Tarpit From HELL)

• Outcast Liason
• Shas'ui with Markerlight
• 2 Priests(1 squad didn't have a priest)

• 40 Glade Guard
• 10 Sisters of Ash
• 6 Po'vre Liasons
• Orion Pax in a Crisis Suit
• 3 Demiurg Bombardiers
• 3 Demiurg Ironbreakers

dragoon's army HQ: Demiurge Brotherhood Elder -109 2x Shield Drones EMP grenades

HQ: Honor Guard 180

• Transport: Devilfish 95

• disruption pod

• HQ: Tau Commander- 169

• 2x shield drones
• Stimulant injector
• Cyclonic Ion Cannon
• Missle Pod
• Plasma Rifle

• HQ: Tau body Guard Team -154

• Burst Cannon
• 2x Shield Drones
• Flamers
• Stimulant injectors

• Elite: Riptide 238

• two shielded missile drones
• Elite: Tarellian Sand Stalker 165
• Tau Shield generator

• Sand Master
• Troops: Brotherhood Warrior Squads 110

• 3x ion rifles

• Troops: Brotherhood Warrior Squads 110
• Troops: Dog Soldiers 142

• Hatchleader, sword, poison

• Transport: Sandjunker 70 points

• Disruption pods

• Troops: Dog Soldiers 142

• Hatchleader, sword, poison

• Transport: Sandjunker 70 points

• Disruption pods

• Heavy Support: Demiurge Bombidier 300 points
• Heavy Support: Demiurge Steelclad 180

• Sponson quad turrets

• Fast Attack: Ironbreaker light tank 240

• Sponson burst cannons

Notes

• For 20 Points, giving a 4++ Invuln save to anything I damn well pleased was pretty broken. Especially when only 120 points was needed to give 4++ to 170 models, which equated to only .7 points per model to gain the save.
• Ion Dampeners meant that for the Bombardiers, there was literally no reason you shouldn't be using the Overcharged Annihilator Rounds. It was hilariously redundant
• Steelclads apparently fulfilled the exact same role as an Ironbreaker, except they had a little better armor. I talked it over with Dragoon, and we decided it would be better to change them so they worked similarly to the Leman Russ Vanquisher. As in, Dedicated Tank-Killers.
• Still not impressed by Ranghon, though they would have worked better on this map, I gave them all 4++ anyway, and avoided the Nalwoods purely because they were difficult.
• Overall, I am very impressed by the Demiurge. A single Honor Guard Squad with 2 Shield Drones managed to survive until turn 5, with some 60% of my army Focus Firing it
• SandStrikers are Amazing. Not as dedicated combat units, but simply as Anti-Tarpits. With good timing, you can use them to effectively shut-down a tarpit, and keep it FIRMLY away from anything that would get bogged down in them.
• Strike Teams Are GOD-TIER suicide Squads, which can be massed-up for dirt cheap and dropped wherever you need a distraction. I'd recommend mixture of flamers and plasma guns so you can hunt hordes or MCs. Since they come standard with EMP Grenades, you can kill tanks with them. When your opponent fails to kill all of the squads that came down, just charge as many tanks as your heart can handle in the following turn and fry them to a crisp. At BS4, they're not too bad at doing good amounts of damage to whatever needs a hurt thrown around.

Despite their lack of durability, 8 Strike Teams hitting the ground makes for a wonderful DISTRACTION CARNIFEX. An opponent who SUDDENLY finds his entire army is systematically being ripped apart from the inside will undoubtedly start panicking.

Turn 1 Dragoon's Army deployed first, having clustered his Bombardiers in a single squad in the corner. His Ironbreaker Squad also deployed in a tight cluster. The rest of his forces were spread relatively evenly across the deployment, with an Honorguard Demiurge squad making up the center. Most of his forces were Demiurg and Tarellians.

I deploy second, and choose to keep my Bombardiers spread out completely to ready myself for Counter-artillery, as I expect to lose just one at a time from his squad. I also deploy my Ironbreakers right across from his, though honestly they would have done a lot more damage countering his transports and massed infantry on the other side of the board. All 120 of my Conscripts went on the board, and were spread out as much as I could POSSIBLY manage with such limited space(It was Dawn of War deployment). 3 of my Po'Vre were attached to the conscripts to grant them 4++(RAW For Shield Drones, hilariously broken when exploited). All of my Ranghon infiltrated into forests, as well as my two sniper teams. Each Ranghon also had a Po'Vre Liason attached to them.

After deployment, I succeeded in stealing the initiative. So turn 1 began with me destroying all 3 of his Bombardiers with only a single bombardier of my own, through a well placed Annihilator Round. The entire remainder of my army moved forward, and ran forward.

Dragoon's Turn 1 began as his Ironbreakers opened fire into my Ironbreakers with overcharged rounds, shaving off 2 hull points, and stunning one of my tanks. The rest of his army moved up, and began firing into my conscripts. However, because of the 4++ saves on all of the conscripts, he was only able to inflict very minor damage.

Orion Pax does pretty much nothing.

Turn 2 7 of my Strike Teams succeed in entering the board. However 2 of them suffered misshaps, and ended up back in reserves. The rest of my army continued its Hell March as I got the conscripts into position to start shredding infantry. Ranghon kept into the forests, while still moving up. My Ironbreakers start moving at this point.

My shooting phase starts as my strike teams start unloading their weapons into strategic targets. Two Plasma Rifle squads are in position to threaten his Riptide, and shooting from them scores both his drones down, and 2 wounds off of the riptide. Another Plasma Rifle squad takes on his Devilfish transport. The Two Flamer squads score a monstrously high number of hits on his Honor Guard, but he succeeds all of his saves, in addition to the hits from my pulse carbines.

All of my Ranghon start shooting into his Honor Guard, shaving off two wounds. My Sniper Squads put a single markerlight into the honor guard, which the nearest conscript squad utilizes to make a whopping 72 BS3 Shots into them, which turned into 13 wounds, and only a single failed save.

Dragoon's Crisis Suits came down right behind my Ironbreakers. And shooting from them destroys one tank, while badly damaging another. At this point Dragoon disembarked one of his Sand Trucks with Dog Soldiers, and combined fire took down just a few more of my conscripts, as well as some Ranghon. His Riptide also did damage to a strike team, but lucky invuln saves left the two plasma guns intact to continue threatening it. His Ironbreakers decided to take a break from attacking my tanks, and killed a few more conscripts. The Demiurge Honor Guard then turned right around and attacked one of my Strike Teams(This is a good trade for me, he's throwing almost 300 points at a 70 point squad). They pretty much slaughter the squad effortlessly.

Orion Pax's thumb is up his own ass

Turn 3

All but one of my Strike Teams has hit the board, and the last team failed to get in. Another flamer team hits the dirt between his riptide and the Honor Guard. I move everything up again, with more than 85% of my forces remaining on the table. My Ironbreakers move 12" away from the Crisis Suits, and a Bombardier also moves 12" away. One Bombardier chucks an Annihilator Round into the crisis suits with a direct hit, and instantly wipes the entire squad. The Other bombardier turns to fire into the Honor Guard, shaving off 4 wounds from the mass. Combined fire from a conscript squad, and all my Ranghon nearly wipes a Dog Soldier Team out. The other conscript squad does jack shit with it's overwhelming mass of shots against his honor guard, even with markerlight support. Orion Pax still has a thumb up his ass.

Another wound is shaved off of the Riptide, bringing it down to 2. Now I have one strike team charge his Ironbreakers, one charges a sand truck, and one charges a Steelbreaker. All but the Steelbreaker goes down to massed EMP Grenades, meaning these units have bought back their points. My Sisters of Ash charge his remaining footslogged dog soldiers and slaughter them completely(These sisters are upsurdly good against light infantry. But they suffer from not having a Pistol Equivalent, unlike banshees(Which share the same purpose)).

With much of his tanks gone, Dragoon keeps his other dog soldiers in their truck. They shoot into conscripts and manage to kill 6 of them in one go(Which is the most damage any single unit has done to the conscripts all game). Riptide wipes a strike team, and his devilfish kills two of the Sisters of Ash. His Honor guard charge my next flamer squad and wipe them completely, again with no casualties. They consolidate now towards my conscripts.

Orion Pax still has a thumb up his ass.

Turn 4

The last strike team hits the board, but he gets Displaced into a far corner by a mishap. The honor guard manage to get the conscripts into combat and start to quickly play wack a human, eliminating about five of them and not losing much in return. They flee away but do to slow and purposeful they can't be wiping from the board with a sweeping advance. Another squad of strike team is taken from the board due to shooting but the others are able to keep going. The dog soldiers are taken out of their sandjunker and spread out to provide a screen for the devilfish. The sandstalkers come in on this turn and shut down an entire conscript unit.

Turn 5 The honor guard finally fall due to ironbreaker and bombidier fire even if they also hit some of their own troops. The only one that remained was the elder but orion is finally able to do something and kill the elder. The dog soldiers basically get wiped out by strike team fire and the sisters of ash. Leaving the only three units on the board as the riptide, devilfish, and the sandstalkers. The game is called here with the majority of the units on evil's side still in play.

While user:evilexecutive will give a more in depth look at the match I will give some of my thoughts on the match. Overall this was a good learning experience for me and a good run for the balance of the codex, seeing what units needed to be reworked or redone. Some of the changes have been increasing the cost on some units and reworking some of the rules on others. Demiurge bombidiers have lost their re roll on gets hot! for now. So there is a clear choice between using the standard rounds and overcharge mode. Fluff wise the ion dampener is not strong enough to withstand the overcharge mode. The steelclad is now a dedicated anti armor unit with the ironbreakers losing their hull mounted burst cannons but retaining their sponson options. The Por'vre is extremely op and the ability to take the shield drones of the shas ui unit with the conscripts should probably get changed out, or at least eliminate their ability to take drones.

My list honestly needed markerlight support if only for the dog soldiers which were extremely effective, the tallarians were agreed to be pretty fun with the sudden appearance of my sandstalkers putting an entire unit of guevesa in a holding action with their arrival from reserve, which unfortunately they had been in for the majority of the match. I probably should have dropped one of my demiurge warrior squads and the devilfish for a different unit to be honest as well. A good sniping unit other than my sandstalkers would have been a great help to take out the por'vre and the shield drones. A unit of Hrenins with a reconscope could have been hella op with the ability to give my riptide sniper, this probably needs to be looked at as being too op.

My bombidiers basically were eliminated during the first turn by his own with only one surviving long enough to get a shot off which did squat against the shield drones of the gue'vesa saal. Honorguard are extremely useful for an IC to camp in as well as being an effective unit. They wiping a couple of units with a game of wack a human. Evil suggests that a shieldwall formation would be the most effective instead of blobbing them up as I did. Another idea I had for them later on was putting each of them into little triangles of three to help keep them a bit more flexible. Without it they lose their 2+ armor save but they are extremely tanky no matter what. Only reason they did not really get more kills was the slow and purposful rule which made them unable to sweeping advance one of the units that fled from them, although to be fair it has I2 which makes that really hard to pull off. Honorguard with the brotherhood elder were basically the MVP on my side although the dog soldiers did a decent job as well.

Ironbreakers were able to put out almost 45 shots a round if you unload all their weapons at once. This can be pretty op but may have solved some of it by removing the hull mounted burst cannon. Steelclad basically did very little damage this match except plink away at some gue'vesa saal, the new changes would do well in this case. Honestly with the steelclad I should have just shot at his bombidiers that were in range of it. That was a big mistake on my part.

As for the Ranghon which evil has never seen them as really competitive in a list, I think they may work a lot better during a playtest against some different armies than the ones they have been fighting, mainly fighting MEQ's and TEQ's may not be the best showing for them. I want to try a few tests against Ork's or tyrinids. Eldar and Dark Eldar may also be a good fight for them as well. They will need more playtesting no matter what as they can always use more fining tuning. Maybe we can further make them different than Kroot which they are extremly similar to right now.Dragoon508 (talk) 05:40, 15 August 2015 (UTC)

So from reading this, it sounds like this Codex faces off pretty well against itself (yay mirror matches) although ending at turn 4 sounds like it rapidly becomes a pound for pound (point for point in this case) type of match, also, why was Orion just sitting around, playing with himself for the entire match? stuck in reserves or something?

I haven't actually written down the rest of the fight. And no it didn't end at turn 4, it actually ended with me Tabling Dragoon at turn 6, with some 70% of my army still intact. No it wasn't a pound-for-pound occasion. Straight Gue'Vasa is easily the mainliners of the entire codex, as they've got good options and synergy. Orion was on the left side of the board in a Conscript Squad, and he got all of just ONE kill n the entire game. Which was the Demiurg Elder with his plasma rifle. Evilexecutive (talk) 22:31, 15 August 2015 (UTC)

Honestly one of my main problems with this was focusing on the gue'vesa'saal units instead of the other ones. If I had not then I would have done a bit better. Or at least have had my tanks focus on his bombidiers and other tanks. When we called the game i just had the sandstalkers, riptide, and a single sandjunker left. The Gue'vesa do extremely well like Evil says. They may need a lot more balancing in that regard against the other units in the codex. Evil would have been better off with running orion in his foot slogger mode since he left him in a blob of gue'vesa'saal. The vollyfire ability he has is pretty potent no matter what. I think after the balancing from this fight if we did the same match again it would end a bit more evenly at the very least. Since it would cost more to get the por'vre and Gue'vesa'saal can't get drones like they could anymore. Also bombidiers run the risk of gets hot rolls now if they overcharge. Those blobs of 30 men with 4++ was pretty potent and op.Dragoon508 (talk) 00:17, 16 August 2015 (UTC)

1500: Codex Tau Auxiliary VS Codex Knights Inductor- Dragoon and evilexectuive

In this map we played on an urban setting with lots of cover and streets. Plenty of places where you could bunker down and defend easily.

dragoon's list

• HQ: Hrenian Stormcommander 90
• HQ:Tarellian Desert Priest 60 points
• Elite: Hrenian Storm trooper squad 142
• Elite: Tarellian Sand Stalker 165
  • sand master, shield generator
• Troops: Hrenian Light Troops 82
  • Chamo cloak, recon scope
• Troops: Hrenian Light Troops 82
  • Chamo cloak, recon scope
• Troops: Kroot Carn squad 155
  • shaper, sniper rounds
• Troops: Tarellian Dog Soldiers 194
  • hatchleader
  • Sandjunker, disruption pod
• Troops: Tarellian Dog Soldiers 202
  • hatchleader
  • Sandjunker, disruption pod
• Troops: Ranghon Gladeguard 150
  • 4x railcasters
• Fast Attack: Pathfinder Squad 55
• Fast Attack: Pathfinder Squad 55
• Fast Attack: Hrenian Sniper Team 63 points

Evilexecutive's List: This is the first time I have ever bothered to run these guys with a full 24-man squad. I gotta say that I'm not impressed with them. By combining all of the men, sure I gain the use Squad Issue Wargear on the dirt cheap, but at the same time those 8 plasma cannons are wasted as they can only fire on one thing at a time. This ended up losing me the game as my squad wasn't able to kill enough things quickly, while everything they targeted pretty much disintegrated.

The Aspirants Trooper Armor gives them S&P, which is wonderful for running heavy weapons. Combined with their relatively high AP weapons and deep strike ability, they make for great suicide squads just like Gue'vasa strike teams. I seem to enjoy just throwing 640 points of them at an opponent and watching him panic as absolutely every strategy he can come up with just falls apart as soon as 10 surgical teams hit his side of the table.

• HQ: Silencer
  • Null Axe, Silencer Level 3
• HQ: Captain
• Troop: Tactical Squad
  • 24 Marines, Aceso, Kraken Bolts, 8 Plasma Cannons
• Troop: Aspirant Squad
  • Multi-Melta
• Troop: Aspirant Squad
  • Multi-Melta
• Troop: Aspirant Squad
  • Multi-Melta
• Troop: Aspirant Squad
  • Multi-Melta
• Troop: Aspirant Squad
  • Multi-Melta
• Troop: Aspirant Squad
  • Multi-Melta
• Troop: Aspirant Squad
  • Multi-Melta
• Troop: Aspirant Squad
  • Multi-Melta
• Troop: Aspirant Squad
  • Multi-Melta
• Troop: Aspirant Squad
  • Multi-Melta

Turn 0 To start off evil rolled hammer and anvil as the deployment type and purge the alien as the mission type. Due to rolls I ended up deploying first as is usual during our matches. I took a very scout and infiltrator heavy force for this battle with my highest armor with my ranghon and stormtroopers. Most of my forces were in cover right off the start with some going to be within cover by turn 2 at the latest due to scout moves. My dog soldiers and sandjunkers deployed together to help keep them together and provide additional protection with the desert priests sand veil ability. Taking advantage of my infiltrate deployment I secured the central building with my kroot. I set up the sandstalkers, stormtroopers, and ranghon in reserve. My warlord is the desert priest rolling a 1 on warlord traits making it a usless roll as they already have prefered enemy.

Evil deployed a rather large squad of knights inductor in one of the buildings providing 4+ cover. Armed with a Silencer and numerous plasma cannons this can and will be a pretty big threat.

Turn 1 The game starts off normally enough with basic movement of the sandjunkers moving forward along with a pathfinder squad and a light infantry squad. The other light infantry squad and sniper team will standback in cover for now. My kroot start to get to work with their sniper rounds hoping to get a lot of precision shots against what I rightly feared as the main threat the plasma cannons. The kroot are only able to get one shot in for a kill knocking out one of the plasma cannons.

Evil starts off his turn pretty strong with hitting the kroot pretty hard with a mixture of plasma and kraken rounds. This wipes out a good chunck of my kroot even with a 4+ cover save. They don't move and just hang out.

Turn 2 Reserves roll around and I am only able to get my stormtroopers into play. Deepstriking them close to the knights inductor marine squad. I DS them out of cover and had to run in order to get them into it, although I was short on my rolls in order to do so. So I lost a turn of shooting I could have used to punish his marines a bit more. My first big mistake of the match happened here as I move one of my light infantry out of the cover they had been in to try to get them into the building in the middle of the map. My sniper team is able to make it into the cover that the light infantry vacated. The other big move was to try to run my other pathfinder squad into the next building in order for them to provide a bit more cover. I had to move my kroot up in order to be in range of the marines but could only snap shot my sniper rounds to hit him, which did nothing major. My other pathfinder squad uses their markerlights to hit the marines for 2 which I use to boost the shooting of the dog soldiers in the sandjunkers. They don't really get past the 3+ armor save.

Evil's aspirant squadrons start coming down in mass with only one being unable to come to the field. One of the aspirant squads drop on top of my light infantry causing a mishap and the death of the entire unit, so first killpoint goes to me. From there the marines try to shoot multiple plasma shots into my sandjunkers but is only able to take off 1 hull point because of the powerful combo of a disruption pod and a desert priest. Two of the aspirant squads have one of my pathfinders squished between them and they quickly slaughter them. My light infantry out in the open gets shot up pretty badly with only 2 troopers remaining, they break and start to flee the field. The other light infantry force gets demolished completely by an asperaint squad, failing all of their 4+ rolls on cover. It should have been 3+ but forgot about the camo cloaks. I also lose one of my pathfinders but they are still a viable squad. The sniper team gets its butt handed to it but maintains one unit still. My kroot take more shots losing the shaper and anotehr kroot.

Turn 3 My reserve brings up my sandstalker with my ranghon being stuck in reserve still. I send the sandstalkers to tarpit his marine squad to at the very least keep his plasma cannons away from the rest of my forces. My remaining light infantry still have not rallied and continue to flee. One of my dog soldiers dismount from their sandjunker and shoot at one of the asperiant squads to bloody them. The other sandjunker shoots the squad behind that and almost wipes them out, leaving a single troop there which I basically ignore to go after bigger threats, this is slightly a mistake later on. My pathfinders shoot up another of the aspirant squads with the help of markerlights and the sole remaining sniper. This squad starts to flee. My stormtroopers take out another of the aspirant squads with their fire. My kroot charge the squad that took out the shaper and lose three more before locking into combat.MY dog soldiers charge the other squad and keep them in combat with no major damage. My sandstalkers do some good damage with their claw swords and gear up to try to keep them occupied for as long as possible.

Evil moves a few units around but overall the board stays the same. The psycic phase comes around and evil is able to get a fear test off on my sandstalkers on a 3d6 which they lose but are able to flee safely to the other building. I am hoping to possibly rally them next turn and get some good shooting in with their sniper rifles. But that is not to be as they get hosed down by the marines in revenge for the loses they inflicted. The other aspirant squad touches down and starts to move on my sandjunkers but can't get past the cover saves.The dog soldiers kill off the rest of the aspirants and consolidate to go after anotehr squad as the kroot remain locked in combat.

Turn 4 My ranghon come in automatically and set up south of the marine squad. My dog soldiers move to get closer for a charge. My sniper tries to eliminate the sole suvivor of the northern squad but is unable to wound. My empty sandstalker shoots at one of the remaining asperants to whittle them down but only does 1 kill. My pathfinders take out a couple more aspirants causing them to flee with their sole survivor. My stormtrooper takes out the last southern squad. My dog soldiers take out the aspirant squad they fought in the first turn of combat and consolidate to take on another in the next turns. The overwatchs have not been doing well against the dog soldiers and my saves seem to be really good this time around. My kroot die and the squad consolidates to try to take out my sandjunkers.

Not much movement this time around from evil as he is just staying in cover as much as possible with just a little movement to get closer to one of my sandjunkers to try to take it out. Shooting starts with the aspirants popping the sandjunker with krak grenades making the squad pour out and get into the building as quickly as they can. They have to make a pinning test but pass it. They are looking to get revenge by the next turn it seems. The marines try to shoot up the squad badly but have a hard time getting past the 3+ cover save I have going on at the moment.One of the last fullish squads goes and pops the last of my sandjunkers. The sole remandier of the northern squad kills my last sniper biting my butt in not being able to get rid of him ealier.

Turn 5 Not much shooting on my part besides some shots before I charge which are mainly saved. The charges into squad that took down the first sandjunker resolves reletivly quickly and that squad is wiped out. My pathfinders charge the last squad in the south that has only one remaining person which causes a pretty even fight. Even with three pathfinders, tau just suck in close combat. My other dog soldiers try to charge but fail their charge so are unable to fight.

Some shooting goes on but no major losses besides the wiping out of my stormtroopers by the marines with several plasma cannon shots. Those in combat with my dog warriors die this turn and I move to try to take out his remaining asperaints. The pathfinder fight keeps going with no wounds taking on either side. Evil currently had the lead at this point with a roll to see if we continue happens. We move to turn 6

Turn 6 Not much happens here as I move more into cover to help defend against the plasma cannons and wipe out his last aspirant squads. The tau actually beat a lone human in CC so that is a win there.

Evil looks at the board and concedes the game to a Tau Empire victory, seeing that the best he could hope for was to tie the game. 10-9 in kill points.

What I learned

Overall this game went pretty well for me even if it ended up really close. The lose of two of my units could have been delayed at the very least if I had just moved from cover on the first turn instead of the 2nd. The MVP's were the Tarrellion dog soldiers to be honest, they work very similar to orks but not as good in melee with a lot of utility powers. I have not used all of the units for them yet but they just need minor tweaking to get a great force out of them. Although this may change if I play more of them besides the ones I have so far.

Hrenians seem to be way to over costed right now. While the stormcommander may just need to be dropped five points. The other units I took need a price drop. Light infantry can afford to be dropped to 9 or 10 points a unit even if they get good gear. They can't take the bodies that is also needed so it balances out. Stormtroopers are way too pricy for what they do. They are really good don't get me wrong but they are 35 points a model right now. They need to drop to maybe 20 points a model. Snipers are about 21 points a model and probably need to be about 15 points a model. They are pretty good if you can use them right but this time around I did not.

This match was semi tough for me mainly because I had nothing besides the stormtroopers to get past that 3+ save against the sheet number of marines he had, although by the end of the fight he was down to half of his marines.Dragoon508 (talk) 05:16, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

Here's the thing, whenever you want to try and figure out the cost of the Hrenian Models subtract 10 from the base unit cost, so the cost per model for the Hrenian Light Infantry would be 9*5=45, +10 for the squad leader for a total of 55, this is the general rule for every Hrenian infantry unit, the exception to this is the Sniper squad, who work out to 13 points for a spotter (((75-10)/5)=13), and 25 Points for each sniper, if with this info, you feel the cost still needs to be dropped, I'll figure something out, although, I think most of the costs are fairly decent. The Greater Meh (talk) 12:58, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

Well even with taking off 10 points you are still paying 33 points per model for stormtroopers. Which is pretty expensive for a non-TEQ model. The snipers still need that points drop as well because 25 points for that is still pretty expensive even if recon scopes are nice. That is still really expensive for a unit, but still the main offenders are the stormtroopers that are just too expensiveDragoon508 (talk) 15:47, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

Fairy Nuff, knock the Storm troopers down to 25 Points, Storm Raiders to 30, Snipers to 18, taking into account Gets Hot!, infantry to 8, Engineers to 12, Spotters can stay as they are, bikes down to 19, Commander at 80, that all sound good? The Greater Meh (talk) 22:55, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

Yea that sounds a lot better than what they had. Dragoon508 (talk) 00:03, 19 August 2015 (UTC)

Codex Tau Auxiliary and Sisters of Battle 1500 points: Evilexecutive and dragoon508

dragoon's list

• Warlord HQ: Canoness 130
  • 2x inferno pistols, Rosarius, cloak of st aspira
• HQ: Canoness 135
  • Evisorator, Rosarias, mantle of ophelia

• Fast Attack: Dominon squad 213
  • 6x sisters, veteran superior, 4x melta guns, Simulacrum Imperialis, melta bombs
• Transport: Immolator
  • dozer blade, stormbolter
• Fast Attack: Seraphim 110
  • veteran, melta bombs, 2x hand flamers

• Troops: Sisters 185
  • veteran, heavy flamer, flamer
• Transport: Rhino, storm bolter

• Troops: Sisters 185
  • veteran, heavy flamer, flamer
• Transport: Rhino, storm bolter

• Elite: Celestian Squad 235
  • Simulacrum Imperialis, combi flamer, flamer, heavy flamer, power sword, melta bombs
• Transport: Rhino

• Heavy Support: Exorcist 125
• Heavy Support: Retributor Squad 170
  • 4x heavy bolter, veteran, signum

Evilexecutive's List: 100% Gue'Vasa Master Race

• 40 Conscripts
  • Shas'ui
• Po'Vre Liason
• Orion Pax
• Decom Banecrawler
• 6 Snipers
  • Markerlight, Rail Rifle
• 6 Snipers
  • Markerlight, Rail Rifle
• 6 Snipers
  • Markerlight, Rail Rifle
• 6 Snipers
  • Markerlight, Rail Rifle
• 6 Snipers
  • Markerlight, Rail Rifle
• 6 Snipers
  • Markerlight, Rail Rifle
• 6 Snipers
  • Markerlight, Rail Rifle
• 6 Snipers
  • Markerlight, Rail Rifle
• 6 Snipers
  • Markerlight, Rail Rifle
• 6 Snipers
  • Markerlight, Rail Rifle

Turn 1 I start by deploying my BaneCrawler in the center of the table, alongside Orion's Conscript Squad. The Po'Vre Liason attaches to the Conscripts to grant them a 4++ save, and I hand them Feel No Pain. Two Sniper Teams deploy on a tower, and the 8 remaining await infiltration.

My opponent deploys all of his sisters inside various Rhinos and Immolators, and has a Church-organ-of-doom sitting in good vehicle cover. I respond by infiltrating all of my snipers in various conditions, grabbing as much cover as I possibly can(Though a few squads infiltrated out in the open)

He then proceeds to Seize The Initiative. So turn 1 begins and his middle Immolator fails to do anything to my BaneCrawler with his Multimelta(it Whifflebatted). His middle Rhino fires at a sniper squad in the open, and they go to ground. All 4 cover saves succeeded, and then his Church Organ fires 2 krak missiles at the same sniper squad, also succeeding both cover saves. That ends Sisters of Battle turn 1.

I start the battle by moving my BaneCrawler up 12", and Ramming his Immolator. My Roll on THUNDERBLITZ was a 5. It suffered a Strength 12 hit, against FA12, and I rolled a 1 to pen. A Weapon Destroyed result takes out his multimelta. I have a sniper squad Markerlight the damn thing, and then shave off a hull point by glancing it. My Baneblade then busts it open with a heavy burst cannon. The Baneblade split-fires EVERYYTHING to spread the love all over the place, and wipes an entire squad of Sisters. I mistakenly though its Heavy Railgun was the Railgun from the Hammerhead(IT'S NOT), and failed to chip a hull point off of the Church Organ.

Pax's Conscript Squad then fires 72 shots into a squad of sisters, wiping them out to only a single model. Snipers spread the love of Sniper Rounds into a bunch of vehicles, chipping hull points everywhere.

Turn 2 More brings down a squad of snipers. He pops a second squad off of the top objective, and they fail their morale. Dragoon's Seraphim fail to get on the board this turn. He manages to take two objectives. Not much happens then.

My BaneCrawler starts up my turn by moving a full 12" STRAIGHT INTO A RHINO. I then proceeded to roll a 6 on the THUNDERBLITZ table, and destroy it instantly. The Explosion kills 7 sisters inside. At this point I learn from my opponent that the Heavy Railgun is a 110" Range, Strength D cannon. So I use all of my snipers to Markerlight the remaining 3 sisters next to my BaneCrawler, but don't shoot their other guns. My Bane Crawler then utilizes 2 markerlights to grant it BS5 for ALL of its shooting(Thank you RAW, I love you soo much!). One Twin-Linked BS5 Heavy Railgun fires into the Church Organ, and I roll a 6 on the Destroyer Table, which vaporizes it completely. My Baneblade then Split-Fires basically everything into absolutely everything yet again, all at BS5, and kills even more shit indiscriminately.

This time my Conscript Squads target a group of Celestians, and pump 40 more shots into them at BS2, which kills a single model.

Turn 3 Dragoon disembarks his Sisters into the top objective, and moves his second Immolator just barely out of LOS for the Bane Crawler. All of his remaining sisters move into ruins that BLOS with the Bane Crawler. He finishes up his turn by Charging his Celestian squad into my Conscripts. At that point they eat 135 Lasgun shots at BS1, and lose all 9 remaining celestians. Which leaves only the Cannones to melee my guys. I chip off 1 wounds from her in melee, and she kills a conscript. We tie combat.

Dragoon's Seraphim Squad drop behind my snipers on the 2nd Tower, and kill both tower squads with flamers, leaving only a single sniper model who passes morale.

My BaneCrawler does exactly what I expect it to do as a 9-hull-point-remaining-rape-machine sitting in the middle of the table. It moves to threaten his last remaining Immolator, and kills it with 2 glances, which it fails both 3+ covers(poor thing). Submunition Rounds from my Heavy Railgun wipe 9 out of 10 of the sisters sitting on objective 1, while split-fired Long-Barrel Burst Cannons kills the 10th.

My Snipers remove his Rhino sitting on Objective 1 up top, and I fail to inflict any wounds on his warlord, while losing 3 models in melee. They pass their morale thanks to stubborn(Unmodifiable LD10 from Pax). The one sniper gets revenge on Seraphim by killing a single Sister with his gun.

Turn 4 Dragoon Concedes Defeat as 94% of my army remains intact, to his 5%. The Bane Crawler is still active and at full health, while 8 of my sniper squads are still on the table. The Conscripts aren't going anywhere anytime soon.. Or ever. Thanks to the magic of 4++ saves. And even if the Cannoness beats the conscripts in melee, she would still be alone against an entire Bane Crawler.

What have we learned?

• Pax is love, Pax is life
  • Seriously, he's great for just sticking in a squad of Conscripts, as him granting them Volley Fire makes them unholy rape-machines in shooting and assault. Being able to effectively stop any charge with infinite lasguns
• The Bane Crawler is really fucking terrifying. While it loses the Baneblade's Capability of wrecking formations of vehicles, it's incredibly versatile thanks to the rules for Superheavies. You can Split-fire every gun at as many targets as you please, so what that leads to is spreading your firepower over entire armies. It can threaten big-shit with its Strength D cannon, but where it REALLY shines is against Light Vehicles and MEQ, as it can wound-spam, and glance-spam like nobody's business. The ability to use markerlights pretty much turns this into a gamebreaker.
  • Needs a big points increase, and could do with neat options.

Honestly as soon as my dominions bit it, I knew I was going to lose this game hard. The bane crawler needs a big points increase to probably around 1250 points, the manta sits around 2k points and the crawler has a lot of the same power without being a flyer nor transport. So that would have been a better point cost for it. I simply had nothing to take on a superheavy even with my exorcist and dominions. My other hq with an evisorator could have possibly done something but did not want to run it across the board and had kept it back to provide cover for my exocist just in case. This is actually the first time I have seen someone use a super heavy so it was something I simply did not know how to deal with nor what they could do. This is the same with Str D weapons. I would like to see the crawler fight a unit of imperial knights though, it probably would do really well.

1250 points is -entirely too many- points for what is essentially a Baneblade Variant. I would say about 625 points is more accurate, with the upper bounds of 650. It's a solid tank from what I can tell, but it's not as powerful as an entire titan. >.> Evilexecutive (talk) 02:26, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Well remember that the heavy railgun is basically the tau's anti titan weapon. However you are right, a manta could honestly have taken on both of our forces combined and might have lost only about half its hull points because just one of its weapon systems is 16 long barreled burst cannons. However 625 is still probably too low as it is pretty powerful, maybe moreso than a baneblade. I think probably between 750 and 1k points may be the best place to put the points cost. Although we may want to try to have it fight some other super heavies to see what it can do.Dragoon508 (talk) 02:30, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Don't forget that the Shadowsword variant has a Strength D Blast weapon, and sponsons, at only 500 points. You mentioned that you don't have experience with superheavies, and heres where part of that shows. The banecrawler has a similar cannon, and more dakka sponsons, but despite that its largely inneffective against medium and heavy armor. Plaued smart, equal points of Leman russ tanks could bring one down.Evilexecutive (talk) 02:37, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Alright I will bow to your experience here on this, so 625 will be the point cost for now. As for some options I was thinking of letting them take seeker missiles at the very least. Another option is to let them take fusion blasters in place of a long barreled burst canon. Dragoon508 (talk) 02:47, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Eh', Fusion Blasters are a meh' thing to replace the Long-Barreled Burst Cannons with. You're making it a much closer ranged vehicle, and also changing its role considerably to that of an odd bastardization of long-range support, and close-range tank killer. It would actually kinda decrease the points efficiency, meaning its less of an upgrade. I would suggest giving it a Drone Controller, or the option to take "Targeting Cogitators" for +1 BS, at +50pts. And then further give it the option to take drones with the Drone Controller. Evilexecutive (talk) 02:57, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Would drones even work with a vehicle though? They are built around being in an infantry unit and actually share some stats they take from that unit. So probably a bad idea there. Plus if they can use markerlights then that may be a bad idea to give them somthing to boost the BS of them. Oh also just looked up the shadowsword. They actually got a points drop to 450 now.Dragoon508 (talk) 03:05, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Drones are pretty much already setup for vehicles, as they embark upon it like it's a transport with dedicated firing ports. It could probably have something around 6 or 8 drones attachable to the Banecrawler. You'd still need to purchase them, but it would be a great option to add more close-defense firepower, and would better flesh out its options.Evilexecutive (talk) 04:07, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

possibly this could work. I was thinking that you wanted the ones not attached to a vehicle like the ones in the front of the devilfish for instance.Dragoon508 (talk) 04:44, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Yea, though this is a superheavy we are talking about, so having them more spread out across the vehicle would work a hell of a lot better(There's more space to work with than just the front). The simplest would be to have 4 on each side, or 3 side guns Chimera Style, and 2 more chevron formed at the front. I'd have to paint a picture for you of what I mean. Evilexecutive (talk) 05:03, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Or you could also do a diamond shape, two in the tip front, two on the side, and two on the rear. I think though going with six drones is probably the best, can do two on the front corners, two in the middle, and two on the back corners.

Gundrones or Marker Drones are probably best, on Points wise I'd like to vote that we put the points cost to 700, as teh Bane Crawler has something that no Baneblade variant has, the Banecrawler has Skyfire The Greater Meh (talk) 15:14, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

After having played against them twice, conscripts should probably just be removed from the codex as they can just become too OP and exploitable. As evil has proven in that regard they are simply too good when I designed them to be extremely expendable troops. Instead they easily are the best tarpit and anti assault force you can get. The 4++ just gives them such an advantage even if they only have lasgun's. Orion can be extremely powerful, however if we remove conscripts he should not be as bad. So if anyone wants to chime in on keeping conscripts say your piece now.

We have more "Blob" type units that can still use the 4++ save exploit, the Formosian's, Glade Guard, and Deathsworn come to mind, I think the big problem here is that Orion Pax's Volley Fire makes them a block of infinite fire, and that's really supposed to be how Lasguns present any kind of threat in the 40K universe, so I don't think we should remove the unit entirely, but they're supposed to be Trainee's/Cadets, so why would the Tau, the people who try to make sure that their soldiers and equipment survive each battle bring out massive clumps of barely out-of-boot Greenhorns. as such the best measure might be restricting the number of Gue'Vesa'Saal squads you can bring on the battlefield to 1-2 as they're only there to be trained and not as a serious fighting force. The Greater Meh (talk) 17:21, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

I still vote that we take them out, if you really want a conscript squad you should just take an IG detachment which the Tau Auxiliary rules lets you make battle brothers to represent the Gue'vesa who have not been trusted with tau tech as in the fluff. This gives the added benefit of not being able to cheat the system with adding a por'vre since they would be unable to be attached to them because of only being able to attach to kroot or tau aux units. As for pax. Maybe make it so they can't volley fire with lasguns on overwatch or make it happen every other turn? Too help counter the blob spam of 4++ rolls, should we just take out the por'vre as well? It was put in there to represent the water caste and give the unit access to etherals and other main tau dex stuff.Dragoon508 (talk) 18:20, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Honestly the two units that won the game for Evil were the crawler and the conscripts. The snipers did pretty well for themselves although if I had not conceded the game then my sepherium would probably have wiped out at least two more squads of them. I did not expect to win this game with sisters however as they are not the greatest force out there, now if I had brought some allied skitarii like I was thinking about I could have taken out Pax and the shield drones on the conscripts with their massed precision fire.Dragoon508 (talk) 02:23, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Snipers are cheap as dirt infiltrators, with decent weapons. Because of their relatively low cost and squad size, you can easily spam them just like the Strike Teams. Though I wouldn't take them in squads of 3, they seem to work much better as 6-man teams(I accidentally put them as 5-man teams in this game, and only noticed my mistake on turn 3). You can use them to give yourself some really great rapid-reaction ability for a low cost. Evilexecutive (talk) 03:00, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

A drone with a shield generator only gives itself a 4++ save. It makes it a slightly more solid ablative wound. Volley Fire only works in the shooting phase.--Bobthe6th (talk) 23:02, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

See there's a problem with that Volley fire in that that it's open to interpretation, A Multi-Tracker only allows the model with it to fire 2 weapons in the shooting phase, but the Overwatch attack is defined as a normal Shooting attack, and follows all of the rules for a normal shooting attack, including modifications, during the Assault phase, this has led to (at least in my group) fierce debate (loud, loud, bitching) that my crisis suits should only be allowed to fire 1 of their Flamers on overwatch, despite Multi-Trackers allowing them to fire both Flamers in the Shooting phase, personally I prefer Volley Fire working in Overwatch, it seems like it was designed to be used in Overwatch, Gearing up a Gunline to brace against a charge, but it's as clear as Mud, and I doubt we'll ever get an answer that pleases everyone. The Greater Meh (talk) 23:59, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

No, it isn't. Those are dumbasses in your group. Nothing fires more then once in the overwatch phase, it is the Overwatch phase... not the Shooting phase. Monstorus creatures still only fire one of their guns... Same thing with Vollyfire. Also the buff gear in Codex Tau only works in the shooting phase. It is actually really clear, but the same dumbasses that argued for the helldrakes ass cannon will argue for multi-target on the overwatch... will argue that the shield drone acts as the helmet of the lion. You don't actually have to listen to them. Volley fire doesn't work in overwatch because it is supposed to buff shooting, not make charging suicidal... As the 120+ las gun shots has shown.--Bobthe6th (talk) 01:11, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

There is an argument here about whether or not they work in Overwatch. Most people go with the "Multi-trackers only work in the Shooting Phase not the Enemy Assault Phase" side of the argument, although there are some notable exceptions (like the NOVA tournament organizers) that think otherwise. Make your own judgement call (Taken from the Tau Tactics Page) Plus, here's a question, was Volley Fire designed with squads of 40+ Tau firing all at the same time, at the same target? The Greater Meh (talk) 09:04, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

So I have officially taken out the Gue'Vesa'Saal unit. While there are other blob options in the codex that can get the 4++ save, the Gue'Vesa'Saal were the only ones who could also be affected by volley fire, voice of the Gue'vesa, and the priest of the Greater good. It was this combination that was way too good especially for the price of a basic blob of 20. Ranghon, formisians, and other blob armies still can take the por'vre.Dragoon508 (talk) 07:07, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

Again, shield drones do not give the whole squad a 4++. The shield drone gets a 4++.--Bobthe6th (talk) 14:34, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

1500 pts demigurge VS necrons

I have played a game versus Necrons my list Demiurg

• Brotherhood elder

gravitic impeller

• warrior squad 6

3 ion rifle

• warrior squad 6

3 ion rifle

• iron brother 5

Dubble twin linked ion rifle 35
champion

• twice 1 mining probe

• bombardier 3

• twice 1 rune smith

• deflection shield

area firebase 1482

he had 2 arks full of warriors 3 wraith 1 unit of lichgard with 2 charter (1 uniqe) 3 jet bick tingeis with ingore cover (i do not know there name)

the short desprcipton of the game My oppont (a power player) rage quit a turn 3

Why i placed 5 ap 2 blast a turn had to many vicles and evry thing else was powerfull

my conclusion most of these moddels are underpriced and over stated (if people want i can write the things that happend in more detail)

Swordfish gunship

I almost want to suggest that the rear armor gets boosted to 12 to reflect the earth caste having to make the rear of the vehicle more sturdy to hold the weight of two railgunsDragoon508 (talk) 05:31, 22 June 2015 (UTC)

I think we should take this out along with the other fire caste options for this codex, instead we can do a dataslate style codex for each one, this way they will count as being a part of Codex tau empire and not codex tau Auxiliary. But they are not actually a member of the Auxiliary so that alone should be a good reason to get rid of them. The air, water, and earth caste units can probably stay as they are not really a part of the regular tau military like the fire caste is. This will help take care of the space issue we have currently with the auxiliary codex at least to start.Dragoon508 (talk) 07:11, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

Hrenian

Looks like a lot of the entries are not done yet rules wise. I kind of think they would have a good synergy with the Ranghon that I want to test out when they are ready.Dragoon508 (talk) 22:59, 3 July 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, I plan on putting in a set of veterancy rules, and the ability to wrap squads together, in the opposite of the Space Marines Combat Squads rule. However they're mostly done when it comes to units. The Greater Meh (talk) 07:44, 4 July 2015 (UTC)

One thing I just noticed is that the storm armor wearing units don't have deep strike when they should because of the jetpack. The APC should also be able to take 6 models in case you want to drop an IC in the squad of light infantry for instanceDragoon508 (talk) 22:08, 4 July 2015 (UTC)

You may also want to give the HQ some options such as taking a cloak. The light troops should be able to take a smash weapon as well if they wantDragoon508 (talk) 05:19, 16 August 2015 (UTC)

Possible Hrenian Rule - Veterancy

Veterancy Hrenian mercenaries often find themselves working over the course of incredibly long campaigns, with very little reinforcements on the way, save for raw recruits fresh out of training, as such most Hrenian forces will be made out of squads with varying degrees of experience, rather than keeping all of the elite units to a single force. By spreading their veterans over their forces, most Hrenian mercenary forces often use combat as just another training exercise, the veterans guiding the recruits under their command to greater effect than would be normally possible.

A Hrenian force may take as many Veteran units as it can afford, however there can be no more Elite units than there are Veteran units divided by two, and there may only be one Heroic unit per detachment, and only troop choice may be taken at a Rookie Veterancy level.

The cost to upgrade a unit to any rank, is cumulative with increasing it to a previous rank (so the total cost per model for a Heroic unit should be +10 points/Model)

unit	Rookie -2 Points/Model	Specialist +2 Points/Model	Veteran +3 Points/Model	Heroic +5 Points/Model
Storm Commander	N/A	+1 Ld (Max 10)	+1 BS, Equipment	+1 BS, +1 WS, Special,
Light Infantry	-1 I, -1 WS	+1 Ld (Max 10)	+1 BS	+1 Ld, +1 W, Special
Combat Engineers	-1 I, -1 WS	+1 Ld (Max 10)	Fleet USR	+1 Ld, +1 W, Special
Storm Troopers	N/A	+1 Ld (Max 10)	Special, Equipment	+1 BS, +1 W, Equipment
Storm Raiders	N/A	+1 Ld (Max 10)	Special, +1 BS	+1 BS, +1 W
Spotters	N/A	+1 Ld (Max 10)	Equipment	+1 BS, +1 Ld, Special
Sniper Squad	N/A	+1 Ld (Max 10)	Equipment, Shrouded	+1 BS, +1 Ld, +1 W, Special
Scout Bike Squad	N/A	+1 Ld (Max 10)	Ignores Cover	+1 BS, +1 W, Special
Assault Buggies	N/A	+1 FAV, +1 SAV	Move Through Cover	+1 BS, Special
Terrapin APC	N/A	+1 AV	Equipment	+1 BS, Special

This seems overly complicated, it probably needs to be a simply upgrade not a 4 tier system.Dragoon508 (talk) 21:49, 5 July 2015 (UTC)

Yeah, but I have no clue how to actually do that, I mean I can do the scanner variants that I was planning on adding, but I've no clue how to do this particular system. The Greater Meh (talk) 23:12, 5 July 2015 (UTC)\

Honestly an idea for a vet unit would be something similer to sisters. In that you can promote a sister supierer to a vetren sister supierer. Instad of this though the squad would become a squad leader stat line while the squad leader promoted to the next levelDragoon508 (talk) 13:23, 6 July 2015 (UTC)

So Something like this? The Greater Meh (talk) 17:04, 6 July 2015 (UTC)

Yea that is probably the best way to do it, it is a lot simpler like that

Okay, I'll need to work out the Special Options, Equipment Options, and USR's, but it should be done by tomorrow DONE, see below for a list The Greater Meh (talk) 16:26, 7 July 2015 (UTC)

Look good, should be interesting to run them. 20:11, 7 July 2015 (UTC)

The only reason I haven't put the Commander Veterancy options in yet, is I'm still debating on whether or not to stick in Heroic Veterancy as a "Relic" in which case that would be the Commander's option Regular Veterancy or Heroic Veterancy, where he can buy multiple upgrades (up to 3) from both the Storm Trooper & Storm Raider lists. The Greater Meh (talk) 23:42, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

Lets get some playtests in before you stick in relics for now. I think these guys along with morrellions need a lot of playtesting same with the demiurge and nicassar.01:48, 14 July 2015 (UTC)

Infantry

The entire squad may purchase Veterancy for 5 points/Model; this increases each models Ld by +1, and increases the Squad Leader's BS by +1

Combat Engineers

The Entire Squad may purchase Veterancy for 5 Points/Model; This increases each Models Ld by +1, and grants the Squad the Fleet USR.

Storm Troopers

The entire squad may purchase Veterancy for 5 Points/Model; this increases each models Ld by +1, and gives the Squad leader the choice of 1 of the following options ---

• May purchase an Experimental Electronic Dampener for 15 Points, the Squad Leaders Weapon loses the Gets Hot! USR.
• May purchase an Extended Barrel, the Squad leaders weapons range increases by 6” for 10 Points
• May purchase a Helical Ammunition Feeder, the Squad Leaders Weapon’s profile changes from Assault 2 to Assault 3 for 10 Points

Storm Raiders

The entire squad may purchase Veterancy for 5 Points/Model; this increases each models Ld by +1, and gives the Squad leader +1 BS & the choice of 1 of the following options ---

• May purchase a Twin-Drum Feed, the Squad Leaders weapon Gains the Twin-Linked USR for 15 points
• May purchase Electro-Magnetic Accelerator Coil Cores, the Squad Leaders weapon gains the Large Blast USR for 5 Points
• May purchase an Advanced Electronic Systems Scrambler, the entire unit gains the Stealth & Shrouded USR’s against any vehicles within 18” for 20 Points

Spotter Squad

The entire squad may purchase Veterancy for 5 Points/Model; this increases each models Ld by +1, and allows the Squad Leader the choice of 1 of the following options ---

• May purchase a Long-Range Magnification Recon Scope for 25 Points. This scope grants the Squad leader the Night Vision USR, and allows him to target a single enemy unit with 60”, any friendly model that has the Sniper USR, or a weapon with the Sniper USR, may make shooting attacks against the targeted unit regardless of range, although they still need line of sight, and the targeted unit increases any cover saves they are currently benefitting from by +1 (Can only increase cover saves, doesn’t actually grant them, so a targeted unit that’s out in the open doesn’t gain a +6 Cover save, however models behind a Aegis Defence Line would increase their cover saves to +3).
• May purchase a Low Altitude Air Support Ordinance Beacon (LAASOB) for 25 Points. A Model equipped with a LAASOB may, once per shooting phase, make an additional shooting attack with the following profile (Range 48”, S:8, AP1,Heavy 4, Barrage, Blast, Ignores Cover), this attack always scatters 2d6-BS (Use the arrow on a result of HIT on the scatter dice).
• May purchase a High Altitude Air Support Interdiction Matrix (HAASIM) for 20 Points. All enemy units arriving via Deep Strike take a -1 to their reserve rolls, and automatically arrive on Turn 6 rather than Turn 5.

Sniper Squad

The entire squad may purchase Veterancy for 5 Points/Model; this increases each models Ld by +1, grants them the Shrouded USR, and allows one model the choice of 1 of the following options ---

• A Sniper may purchase an Experimental Electronic Dampener for 15 Points, the Models weapon loses the Gets Hot! USR.
• A Sniper may purchase an Extended Barrel for 10 Points, increasing their weapons range by 6”.
• A Spotter may purchase a Long-Range Magnification Recon Scope (see above) for 25 Points.
• A Spotter may purchase a LAASOB (see Above) for 25 Points.

Scout Bike Squad

The entire squad may purchase Veterancy for 5 Points/Model; this increases each models Ld by +1, and grants the Ignores Cover USR.

Assault Buggies

The entire squad may purchase Veterancy for 10 Points/Model; this increases each models FAV & SAV by +1, & grants each model the Move Through Cover USR.

Terrapin APC

This vehicle may purchase Veterancy for 10 Points; this increases its FAV, SAV, & RAV by +1, and allows it access to one of the following upgrades ---

• May exchange its Twin-Linked Burst Cannon for a Twin-Linked SMASH Devastator Rifle (Range 36”, S:9, AP3, Heavy 1, Gets Hot!) for 20 Points.
• May purchase a Decoy Launcher (4++ Save against Interceptor Attacks) for 5 Points.
• May purchase an Automatic Emergency Passenger Ejection System for 10 Points. Should a vehicle with this piece of wargear be suffer an “explodes” result on the Vehicle Damage Chart, its passengers are safely ejected 1d6+6” away from the wreck, and may act as if they had just disembarked from a vehicle normally.

Hrenian Scanner Variants

A selection of Scanner Variants that the Hrenians can take in place of the regular Multi-Purpose Battle Scanner The Greater Meh (talk) 16:58, 6 July 2015 (UTC)

High Altitude Predictive Troposphere Scanner: This piece of equipment is a combination of the Hrenian’s regular Multi-Purpose Battle Scanner, & Ionic Storm warning systems, which allows a squad arriving by Stratosphere Altitude Descent to accurately predict the weather of the troposphere beneath them, and land with greater accuracy. A Unit with this piece of wargear only scatters 1d6 when arriving by Deep-Strike.

Low Altitude Predictive Troposphere Scanner: Almost exactly the same as the HAPT-Scanner, the LAPT-Scanner was designed to help grounded Jetpack units continue their movement in the face of extreme weather conditions by automatically calculating the best path through whatever hazard was facing them, and guiding the Storm Jetpacks vectored thrusters accordingly. However, due to the fact that so few planets have Ionic Storms as fierce as the Hrenian home-world, this piece of equipment has been dual-purposed to help Storm Troopers & Raiders navigate through the thick of battle. A unit equipped with this piece of wargear may roll 3d6 for Thrust distance and choose any 2 dice for their final result.

Short-Range Pulse Reflection Scanner: The Hrenians have worked with many different species, often accepting technology that they could not normally hope to acquire as payment; it was from working with the Squats that they gained the Vibro-Sonic Scanner, a radar device that was capable of scanning for multiple, specific minerals, over a range far greater than any other handheld device that the Hrenians had encountered. After several decades the Hrenians finally managed to both reverse engineer the device, but also combine it with their scanner technology to create the Short-Range Pulse Reflection Scanner, a device capable of revealing even the stealthiest of units. A Unit with this piece of Wargear gains the Ignores Cover USR against any enemies within 18”.

Competition for slots

So, I read over the codex. I love some of the races... but I noticed there is just so much that can be freely ignored.

Given that every option is available, you can just cherry pick the best options... which is fine, but leads to several dozen options that are just taking up space. Also options that are just overlapping with other races, with very minor differences.

Like, I can see no good reason to take any Thraxians. At a better price point I can take formosian podborn, who have guns. If I wanted a melee threat, I would take demierge brotherhood troops, with their free power mauls... and the Thraxian's don't do anything but be a melee threat.

There just seems to be a lot of units that are there because X race needs a fast attack choice or a heavy support, or an HQ.

Like, why are MOPP troopers a thing? They are worse deathsworn(worse WS, can't take dedicated transport) but cost more and the squad can't get as big. This sort of issue is spread throughout the codex.

I really do like the verity of specialists. It allows me to build an army that has a unit to deal with any threat, but never more then a couple for each. I just feel like it could be really condensed... as the existing codex is just a gigantic wall of text that takes a really long time to get through. --Bobthe6th (talk) 16:57, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

Probably a rule that needs to be put in is that you can't take more than 2 units of a race unless you have the hq unit of that race as well this can force you to only pick from 2 races if going by the classic or stick them into a unit together and you can make a council of the many. Of course some races don't have an hq choice but that is besides the point because they are a really minor race. Thraxians are still not playtested I believe so we need hard data for them and basically everything on this codex still as most of it has not been playtested.

Then I would never take more then 2 units of a race. There really isn't a good reason to. All the races, excepting a couple, have a couple really good but specialized units. Which is great. The wall of other, terrible options that have to be scrolled past are the part I have a problem with.--Bobthe6th (talk) 17:45, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

While there is a lot of competition for the slots, this is foremost a fluff dex to represent how each of the races go to war, there is still a lot of testing to be done like the MOPP troopers have not seen a game yet as well. Formosians have been considered by me to just be taken out completely as I basically had no ideas for them besides masses of cloned troops lead by a mad scientist type unlike the other races. I think we all wanted to avoid the pitfall of just one or two picks of the race like the main dex has too expand upon the auxillary and give them the option to be composed of just that race if need be. Kroot already have a dex like that with the kroot merc list.Dragoon508 (talk) 17:26, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

Formosians and Ji'atrix are honestly the two best races in the dex. They are very clear on what they add, and do it fairly well(Formosian's being cover camping objective secured troops, and Ji'atrix being scouts with locator beacons). Then I don't have to sift through options and shop across the massive page for the best options. I can see wanting to expand beyond just one option like in the Tau codex, but most of the races are full(overly specialized) armies by themselves. Like, three or four options would probably be a lot more reasonable for lots of them. Otherwise you just end up streatching to get more options were there doesn't really need to be any. --Bobthe6th (talk) 17:45, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

I can see your point. I will keep it in mind I suppose as we do playtesting. There are probably units that can be dumped although to be honest not sure if I even want to dump a majority of these. There are only a couple of units that may be cut in my mind. But it is a good point you make so let me mull it over as well. This codex is not going to be done anytime soon as even if we got all the units we want into the dex(which we may have besides the addition of some more unique, fortifications, and super heavies) the majority of the dex still needs formations. And again the dex needs playtesting something fierce as only evil and I are getting it in when we can, which is looking to be a single game a week with a possibility of 2 a week.

I can possibly start helping to play test. I actually made a 500, 1500, and 1850 point lists for the auxillery.--Bobthe6th (talk) 19:05, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

that would honestly help out a lot, I got my contact information up top in the playtest section, we can hash out a day to play a game.Dragoon508 (talk) 07:03, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

But as you said there is a need to trim some of this down if only to make the dex easier to navigate and when we finally get a pdf of it done it wont be a thousand pages. I think some of the units that possibly can be trimmed are the firecaste units in the tau liasions portion, probably should stick to only other caste tau in there, with the fire caste units added into another dex or single dataslates. Since they are really not auixllary units but mainline just not in the codex fire caste.Dragoon508 (talk) 18:41, 27 August 2015 (UTC)

List of units that can be cut:

Gue'Vesa Combat Engineer, don't really do anything

Going to disagree in that they don't do anything. They are mainly there to mess up charge lanes and help create choke points. Something that is really useful for the tau if you hold a firing line behind a wall of snare mines for instance.

Valkyrie Pisces, which follows the tradition of tau air being trash. The other air unit fills the slot better.

The main idea was to create a flying transport for the Strike Teams to use. But it was basically the only idea I had for them and can/may be changed up to fit better. I would also not say Tau air units are trash as they do have some fairly decent stuff.

Brotherhood Miners, there are other better melee options, and also 40 points for a T4 1W 4+sv model. No, just no.

I will go ahead and take them out then. They originally where but in to give the plasma cutter a dedicated unit along with the melta bombs as an anti armor choice. Their orginal stats will be put up in the demiurge talk space to possibly reworked and readded.

Tarellian Hunting Bikers, overlaps within the race with Hunting Lizards, and does so poorly.

Don't agree here, both of them have different roles with the Bikers being much better at moving through Open Ground, and putting down a shit-tonne of fire with Monster Hunter, while the Riders are much better for cluttered battlefields, and fighting Infantry, both should stay, but seperating them more might be a good idea.

Tau do not need more random high fire power high mobility units. They already have some of the best of those in their battle suits. The lizards at least add the option for a fast assault unit, that can bring EMP nades. The bikes are just standard bike fare and clutter the already bloated Tarellian section.

Galg Sworn Troopers, there are a lot of better fire warrior likes in the codex.

Morrallian MOPP Troops, Strictly worse Deathsworn.

So the ability to pin up to 5 squads at a time, isn't good

What? Is this part of the edit that happened after this post? Even so they could just be an up grade of Deathsworn. The reason to differentiate infantry units are generally different statlines, or different options. This case the two just seem to have a random subset of options. Just making them one unit with a simplified set of options would reduce unit bloat and simplify list building.

Morrallian Waste Runners, Expensive T2 5+ models that need to get very close to the enemy.

Morrallian Undying, a strictly worse crisis suit.

Morrallian Returned, snipers need to be taken in volume. Expensive snipers can't be taken in volume.

Cheapened them, should help

The issue is you can't make them cheap enough without breaking the game. They are multi wound models using a gun that needs to be taken in fairly high volume to matter. It is like putting las guns on a tank. You could make it cheap enough to work, but it would be really silly.

Morrallian Dullahan’s Carriage, they don't need a ground transport.

Agreed, gone

Thraxians(All of them), does the codex need Not!tyranids?

Agreed, I can't think of any way to make them work, but I'm gonna keep hacking at them, offof the codex

N’Deemi Shadow Whispers, can be rolled into N’Deemi Shadow Warriors with an armor upgrade option.

N’Deemi Void Shadows, multiple wounds on T3 units are terrible. When it tacks ~20 points onto the unit...

The cost isn't for the Wounds, but the fact that they have 2 Gravity Weapons (Rifle & Pistol), and the ability to get close almost immediately, with a combination of Obscure(Blind), Graviton, and Infiltrate, they can alpha strike anything, their fragility is their downside, if you still think they need a price drop, then do so, but I wouldn't go below 30 PPM.

I am not arguing for a price drop, I am arguing that they don't really need to exist at all. You are right, it would be insane to drop them under 30 points. It would also be insane to take them for over 30 points. You can just take dual plasma crisis suits for about the same points efficiency, and those can actually shoot more then once before imploding. Honestly the troop choice just need the ability to buy a couple void rifles as special weapons, if Grav is actually the important part.

to be continued--Bobthe6th (talk) 21:05, 1 December 2015 (UTC)

You are correct that some of these need to be taken out if simply for space issues. Thraxions could possibly be taken out and regulated to an economic race. I have also added some comments about the units I designed when you mentioned themDragoon508 (talk) 14:40, 6 February 2016 (UTC)

Brachyura Vehicle Yard - Upgrades

Potential Brachyura addition to the codex, what do you guys think The Greater Meh (talk) 18:14, 25 September 2015 (UTC)

Brachyura Vehicle Yards

The Brachyura are a fairly recent addition to the Tau Empire’s collective.

Diminutive Crustaceans, the Brachyura specialise in the creation, and maintenance of the Tau’s Plasma generators, which are used to power their inventions, Civilian or Military. This has led to several Shas’O’s & Fio’O’s requesting small companies of the Brachyura to set up their vehicle shops alongside the maintenance facilities for any of the Tau’s vehicle returning from combat, so that the diminutive species may aid the Earth caste in the maintenance and upgrading of their war-machine.

The Brachyura offer their services to any members of the Tau Empire, not just their Tau benefactors, and since their inclusion in the Tau Commonwealth there has been a minor increase in the number of Mercenaries joining the fledgling empire, to avail themselves of the Brachyura’s expertise.

Upgrades – These upgrades may be taken by any Vehicle in Codex: Tau Empire or Codex: Tau Auxiliaries

High Power Plasma Fuel Cells – 15 Points

A Vehicle with this upgrade gains the Fast Vehicle type; if it already has the Fast Vehicle type then it gains the ability to make a 2d6” Thrust move in the assault Phase.

Reinforced Plasma Fuel Cells – 10 Points

Whenever a Vehicle with this upgrade suffers a result of Immobilised on the vehicle damage table roll a d6, on a 4+ that vehicle is no longer immobilised, but may only move at combat speed until the end of its next Assault Phase.

Excess Plasma Exhaust Vents - +10 Points

This upgrade must be taken after any other Brachyura Vehicle Upgrade. Whenever a Vehicle with this upgrade is locked in assault any enemy units in contact with this vehicle suffer a S:7, AP4 Wound at initiative step 10, the number of wounds inflicted is equal to the number of models in contact with the vehicle. Armour & Invulnerable saves may be made against these wounds as normal. This upgrade stacks with the Tau Flechette Discharger.

Stabilising Plasma Engine Vents (Flier Only) – 15 Points

A Flier with this upgrade gains the Hover type; if they already have the hover type then they gain the Vector Dancer USR.

High Velocity Plasma Afterburners (Flier Only) – 15 Points

A Flier with this upgrade gains the Supersonic USR.

Magnetic Containment Chamber Refocusing (Plasma & Ion Weapons only) – 15 Points

This upgrade may only be taken by a Vehicle whose primary weapon is either a Plasma Weapon, or an Ion weapon. That weapon’s strength is increased by +1 for all profiles.

Fortifications

I have been played two test games with the tau shield generator (and other models on this page) and I and my opponents found that it is very powerful (read OP). these are the changes I propose and have proposed to my gaming group. I am very interested in your feedback. --BibiFloris

The original

Deflection Field Generator - Any Friendly model within a 6" Radius of this structure is considered to be protected by the deflection shield. A Model protected by a deflection shields that suffers an unsaved wound may roll a D6, if the result of the D6 is equal to, or higher, than the AP value of the wounding weapon then that wound is negated, Weapons with AP1 are automatically saved, while weapons with AP- ignore the Deflection Shield.

My variant

Deflection Field Generator - Any Friendly model completely within 6" Radius of the structure that is hit by a source completely outside the radius may roll a D6 after being hit if the dice roll is equal to or higher than the AP of the weapon/source the hit is discarded. Strength D hits are automatically discarded regardless of AP (note: AP 1 weapons/sources still fail on a 1 and AP- ignores this shield)

The effects of the changes

• also works on vehicles/buildings
• AP 1 has an affect
• S D doesn't anymore
• close combat excluded
• can be negated by moving close (tau's nightmare)
• works before wound instead of after (don't know the combo relationship yet)
• completely not partially under

The second thing I noticed is that on the Demiurge Aerial Defence Cannon twin-linked and reroll 1's has a difference of 5 points nobody will ever pick the ammo pile ass long a twin-linked is available. This is not of play experience but just crunch wise.

Ammunition dump applies to everyone within 6" of the fortification. Evil Executive, CEO of Evil Incorporated (talk) 20:04, 2 April 2017 (UTC)

In my rule book it is within 2 inches of the dump [mini corerulebook] cost standard 20 points and cannot by taken by turrets [stonghold assault]

I have changed the points around of the TL and BS 3 because TW gives you higher to hit change from 2/6 to 3/6 or 3/9 to 5/9 ---BibiFloris

Evilexecutive: Question why make the edits in that way if I may ask? Why the stronghold assault book and not the updated planetary assault? third why leave vehicles out of the shields love?

Getting extra saves against shooting attacks is essentially better than having a reroll. What if you had some riptides sitting cozy up to this shield and sat around with what was essentially a Rerollable 2++? People would cry cheese at it and bitch and moan incessantly. It was also strictly superior to a Void Shield Generator for 25 points less, which wasn't okay, since that negates the entire purpose of having a VSG. Evil Executive, CEO of Evil Incorporated (talk) 20:02, 2 April 2017 (UTC)

It's also not just for vehicles. Vehicles have saves normally to begin with, it's just that they take cover/invuln saves only. You don't have a save? Just take the shield. Evil Executive, CEO of Evil Incorporated (talk) 20:02, 2 April 2017 (UTC)

Because it works after a wound vehicles will by left out of the loop if you want it to work on vehicles then you need to make it wound and glancing/penetrating hit that wy I changed it to on a hit. Giving it instead of normal save is a very good idea.

Why make it stop working on S D (so far I know it was based upon the paradox of duality) that's was stronger equals better save, why make a positive exception (for the S D user) on Strength D in my opinion on S D and this item it should by the other way around. on top of that there is a lore reason. Tau makes no faulty equipment that just works until the end of time (or at least the battle).

Last note how do I put those time/name stamps in there? --- BibiFloris

Indeedy it was based on the Paradox of Duality, something that I believe is a miniaturisation of Tau Starship shielding. That's probably also why giving it the overloads rule (similar to the shield found on the KXV-139 Ta'unar Supremacy Suit) makes sense, it's still a miniaturisation, so certain things will overload the powercells. That said, I'd also include rebooting on a 4+ on the turn after. The timestamped name thing is four tildes (~) with no spaces The Greater Meh (talk) 12:25, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

The paradox of duality is a special item (staff) from aun'va a special charter in the tau codex with the lore I quote "Aun'va's staff projects a protective field whose strength grows with the power of the weapons fired into it" then the rule which is the exact same rule from the shield tower for the exception of making it a bubble instead of the unit bearing it. I also picked up my older codexes and thy mention nothing about a starship. BibiFloris (talk) 13:36, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

I am not up to date on the Battlefleet gothic lore so if it was based on a item / structure there I do not know about that.

Well it's half made-up, half extrapolated, and half-accurate. Essentially Tau Ships are equipped with a Gravitic Deflector sheild that grows stronger the harder it is hit from the front, remaining at a regular strength on all other arcs. I saw the connection between the way this shield worked, and Aun'Va's Paradox, and my brain went "Holy smokes, they miniaturised a Starship shield specifically for Space-Pope. I wonder if they figured out how to make a battlefield generator for it?" fudged some fluff in my cranium, and there you go. The Greater Meh (talk) 14:25, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

Then the link gets a lot more logical. If it is ok, I will add the rule of rebooting and the glance/pen hit and then there is a lot less op and still quite good structure.

I have also added some more Fluff to the model based upon what you wrote down BibiFloris (talk) 15:03, 3 April 2017 (UTC)

Thank you for corrections on those spelling/grammar mistakes Groggarioth

8th Edition Updates

Hey, it's obvious enough that 8th Edition is coming out in a month, and several of the rules are getting systematically leaked online. We know that models now have Movement Values, that weapons have rending values, and vehicles get wounds/hull points. There's also some formatting changes such as Initiative getting dropped in favor of Movement, as well as ballistic skill being shortened to the 'to hit' value that it essentially represented. Seeing as how freakishly huge this fandex is, shouldn't we try to get a head start on updating it to the things we know are confirmed, so as to minimize the codex downtime once 8th edition officially drops? Evil Executive, CEO of Evil Incorporated (talk) 02:28, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

I don't think it'll be that much work, there are some questions that I think should be answered before work begins to prevent doing something that is going to be changed when 8th comes out. Now, I measure work in tens of hours but I'd like to help update this dex so I don't think it'll take more than a week to get out the initial release. What I'm specifically thinking of is when exactly WS becomes a 2+ To Hit and if Movement is just 2 + Initiative or if there are any units which are gonna be less than M 5. Pts are obviously going to be impossible to start working on, since there's there's nothing to compare to and there's the issue of the new points value which I imagine is going to be very interesting for people interested in this codex. Starting before the release effectively also it won't be available for the last of 7th edition. Unless you want to start a new page? Angry Pirate (talk) 06:28, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

I think that having a page already set up even if it does not have models on it yet can drastically help with down time. So I will set up a page and the simple basics and post a link down here. Leaving the 7th rules where the are, is in my opinion a good plan for players hoe want to use the ol d rules, there are going to be more than a few players who do not like the new rules.BibiFloris (talk) 08:31, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Codex - Tau Auxiliary 8th edition I do not know if the name of a page can by changed, so i will leave this link for a day before creating something on this page.

You can change the name of a page under the More tab next to the Search 1d4chan box through the Move function. These sorts of things can be found out via the Help page which is the fourth link under the logo in the top left corner under the Random page link. Angry Pirate (talk) 21:47, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

Talk:Codex - Tau Auxiliary 8th edition I added some things relating to layout and style to the discussion page which I think are worth discussing.

Hmmm did not realize this was still being worked on when I had to go deal with irl. I have not really seen any of the new edition stuff yet, but will check it out and see what I can do to help. Dragoon508 (talk) 10:37, 2 June 2017 (UTC)