Talk:Greater Good

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Creating a god in the way that the stories claims they did, is horseshit. Sorry to tell you anon but there actual are established rules with how that sort of thing happens and this ignores all of them, but let's go through the reasons on why this is a terrible idea that should never have been written down:

Tau allies don't worship the concept of the Greater Good. They don't, plain and simple. In current lore aside from a handful of people (only appearing in Phil Kelly books) the Tau don't have any human allies, they have human slaves who they send off to mining colonies or labour domes.
Time does matter in realspace. When Slaanesh came into existence it couldn't affect events before its birth, same with Ynnead, same here. Even if it were to come into existence at some point, it would be impossible for it to affect anything now.
There isn't enough psychic energy/worship to create it. Both Eldar gods that were created (Slaanesh and Ynnead respectively) are the culmination of millenia of effort from a very psychically powerful race, with the one needing a galaxy-spanning empire to form. The Tau on the other hand would weigh so little in comparison it would be like weighing a drop of water compared to the ocean, it wouldn't have any impact, let alone one that was greater than the birth of Ynnead itself. Hell, there are more humans that worshiped different beings than the Emperor before and after the Great Crusade and that didn't have any near as much of an impact as a few cultists, according to this idea.

So to summarize, Phil Kelly's greater good god is nothing more than a shitty idea that does not hold up in the slightest. -- Triacom (talk) 21:50, 17 November 2018 (UTC)

While I haven't read the books in question, I do recall from the Codex that the Tau of the Fourth Sphere were all exposed directly to the Warp for who knows how long (they're resistant to the Warp, but resistance won't cut it when you're staring directly into the Warp unprotected), and knowing Chaos it's possible something might have decided to show up that they mistakenly identified with a personification of the Greater Good. And now that I think of it, Bel'lakor has been aspiring to make himself into a Chaos God for quite some time and is no stranger to raising cults to himself...Just saying, such a "god" might exist but not in the way these Tau imagine it to.--Newerfag (talk) 03:22, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
They were exposed to the warp, but even ships fully exposed to the warp will still end up leaving it if you activate their engines again, there's no need for any sort of intervention to explain how they got out. Also Fourth Sphere sept Tau don't really care that much for the Greater Good, seeing as how they regard their alien allies (aka the ones who Phil Kelly is claiming to have made it) the same way the Imperium regards the Tau. The books also don't allow for any interpretation of it being an existing daemon like Be'lakor, and it doesn't share his motivations. Lastly Tau aren't resistant to the warp, it's just trickier for warp entities to see them. -- Triacom (talk) 04:24, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
I wasn't talking about the books, I was talking about the Codex and the conclusions I drew from it. The codex explains that they figured out that their alien allies' closer connection to the Warp was what allowed Chaos to be a thing and that killing them was the only way to ensure the galaxy could be safe for the Greater Good. Given the typical protocol in this case, the Codex's interpretation comes first. --Newerfag (talk) 05:06, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
The codex explains that they don't like their allies and leaves their reasoning vague. Chaos would still be a thing even if their allies are gone so even if that was what they thought it wouldn't be them 'figuring it out' so much as 'assuming without a clue'. I agree the Codex interpretation should come first, but this bullshit should still be mentioned seeing as how insistent Phil Kelly is at adding it to his Tau stories, which are still ongoing. -- Triacom (talk) 05:50, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
Then why act as if the books are the one true interpretation of what happened when they aren't? Should we start accepting C.S. Goto's work as canon next? --Newerfag (talk) 07:56, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
I'm not, if you look at the first sentence it says that this only shows up in Phil Kelly's books, then it describes a few things surrounding it, once again from his books, and at the end it goes over why it's bullshit. There's nothing there saying that the books are the one true interpretation, it's just a look at why the books are wrong. -- Triacom (talk) 08:34, 19 November 2018 (UTC)
My take is "just write it off as the Emperor or Tzeentch or Malal messing around with some vague plan"; I assume the rest of you don't want to let it go that easily? 2600:1700:BF90:B950:CDD4:455E:8CC3:5B6E 03:51, 15 December 2018 (UTC)
Nope, because Phil Kelly's books are acting as if that's not the case and so far he hasn't even hinted that this is anything but new deity showing up. If that ends up being the case later then fine, but right now it should be called out for what it is. -- Triacom (talk) 04:57, 15 December 2018 (UTC)

It seems we have some squabbling on the page again about this. I'm curious: why not leave the alternate take? I personally agree that it's a crappy idea (hence labeling it an alternate take) but maybe its fine in order to create a discourse? Or is the inherent problem with that primarily because its so skubtastic? --Lord Of The Lemmings (talk) 06:13, 21 September 2019 (UTC)

It's not an alternate take. The topic already addresses how the Tau have too low a population to do anything remotely close to what the Eldar did, it addresses how making a new god is not unprecedented by referencing Ynnead, and it also addressed the Emperor before that point as well. Remove the words "alternate take" and you just get a repeat of the paragraph directly before it. -- Triacom (talk) 09:16, 21 September 2019 (UTC)

Fair enough. I'll keep an eye on the page. --Lord Of The Lemmings (talk) 15:20, 21 September 2019 (UTC)