Talk:Grimdark

From 1d4chan

Another Example[edit]

Personally I think Transmetropolitian (kinda dystopian Comic series by Warren Ellis from the 90s/beginning 2000s. Any thoughts?

Nobledark?[edit]

I'm wondering if this page needs a section titled NobleDark where the world is crap but it's possible to pull the world out of that state. ilniaj

Not sure if.....[edit]

...this could even be tangentially considered tg-related as I am about to discuss a VIDYA. Spec Ops the Line. reasons to consider mentioning it 1) It is the most successful grimdark setting I have ever experienced in any game ever, it physically made me sick and some points. And I like to think I piss vinegar and bleed motor oil. 2) It is a commentary work on the state of video gaming today (specifically shooters) and the mass of B-tards that play them. 3) It has Bruce boxleighner as a voice actor (the commander from Babylon 5)

Aside from those reasons I don't think that it is related to anything on tg at all. Maybe some wise oldfag could give insight into it.

And please excuse my bullshit.

Not even close to what we consider relevant. And for the record, it says absolutely nothing that hasn't been said years ago back in Apocalypse Now (and Heart of Darkness before that). The only thing missing was somebody saying "The horror...the horror...". Besides, when have we ever cared about shooters? --108.31.78.204 23:09, 25 August 2014 (UTC)

Stop undoing my edits and hash it out on the godamn discuss page. You want to do a little argument here? fine. The following reasons are reasons I believe that Spec Ops: The Line belong on this page.

1)It IS grimdark, and perhaps one of the few examples that really had a powerful impact on people, as it is the one selling point of the game. It's content includes

  • "sanity checks"
  • "Horrifyingly large death tolls are perfectly normal. Just like in real life"
  • "The vast majority are poor people who literally live in shit, dung, crime, and a plethora of all kinds of filthy diseases, except for a few greedy upper 1% who own 99.9% of everything. Just like in real life."
  • "There are no "good guys"; everyone's a jerk, including you. Especially you."
  • "Everyone will most likely die in the end. Especially the ones important to and including the main character."

2) The list already includes a GEARS OF WAR listing which is one of the shootiest shooters there is. The game I am listing is not AAA and is not even that mainstream.

3) The fact that it is based on a book is fine, if anything it adds to the concept of Heart of Darkness, by HAVING someone there to say "the horror... the horror". Which is the whole point of videogames is to involve the player. Any work or creation that adds to its own source material is a worthy foray and addition, NOT trite repetition.

Muv-Luv worthy of the grimdark?[edit]

Just read the Humanity Fuck Yeah article and the Muv-Luv Extra/Alternative real robot stories make for one of the darkest of Visual Novels. In fact the author of Attack on Titan states that he ripped off Muv-Luv. Tough the story is obviously shit compared to Muv-Luv due to lack of Dakka, nuking an entire country, a threat nowhere near comparable to the Beta (Tyranids with more "Imma firin mah LAZOR") and anything resembling a good story until AOT's recent arc where they overthrow the government. Though it might be worth it to wait until the Steam version is released for both Extra and Alternative before adding Muv-Luv to the article.

List[edit]

Seriously, this list is an unreadable mess. How about merely summing things up and linking to the main page (where appropriate)?

List...[edit]

Seconded, this list needs to be:

First, examined, trimmed (we probably don't need an entire paragraph explaining WHY the example is Grimdark) and seriously culled - Fucking seriously? Digimon? A little darker than your average anime for the target demo of TEN YEAR OLDS. Grimdark? FUCK no. If you need to spend that many letters trying to justify an example, it's probably a poor example.

Second, probably exported to a separate page at this point. --Turn-BasedAce (talk) 11:46, 28 April 2019 (UTC)

Ultramar Grimderp[edit]

So, I actually went and double-checked this comic that is mentioned. Turns out, the planet where people die in their early 40s is an Ultramar Sector agriworld named Nova Thulium, NOT Ultramar itself. Malnutrition (almost all of the food is diverted to the rest of Macragge, especially the neighboring hive world of Ardium) and toxic build up in the lungs from the chemical fertilizers are the causes behind the death rate. Also, this isn't the first example of Games Workshop failing some basic population math. Official lore for Catachan is that half of all children die before the age of three, and then a quarter of the surviving children die before the age of ten. Simply maintaining the population with a death rate that high would require every surviving female Catachan produce a minimum of eight kids - and then remember that Catachan also tithes to the Imperial Guard, and that number has to go up! Literally the most sensible way that kind of population deficit can be countered is that Catachan women have some Lina Medina shit going on and can start getting pregnant from the age of 6. So, Nova Thulium's death rate isn't that much of an outlier for Warhammer lore... yes, it's stupid, but frankly, 40K runs on "stupid".--QuietBrowser (talk) 23:42, 17 October 2020 (UTC)

And have a link to the comic for reference: https://readcomiconline.to/Comic/Warhammer-40-000-Marneus-Calgar/Issue-1?id=176611

And it's still completely unsustainable for a planet, especially a place like an agri-world. It's absolutely grimderp to make the average life expectancy is so low, since that means so many people need to die below or at that point instead of retiring. On top of this, the book says that a productive life above 40 is unlikely, so their relatively small work force would be even smaller than they first appear. This is also easily solved, especially for a realm like Ultramar which should have proper safety equipment available for a vital planet that feeds an entire subsector. -- Triacom (talk) 03:31, 18 October 2020 (UTC)

Redo of a Healer[edit]

Are two paragraph on this show (which may or may not be notable enough to be remembered a few years from now) really necessary? Besides, while there is a long description on what sick shit the MC does, there is no mention on why the setting is grimdark (or grimderp for instance). Not that the setting can't be described as grimderp; for instance, the only way to exceed one's "level-cap" (sic) is gulping a male hero's semen every day (sick), and that it makes the MC the perfect target for sexual exploitation. But as they are currently written, there is no mention of the setting, and so those paragraphs don't really fit in the grimdark/grimderp page.

If anything, the dealings of the MC would be way better suited as an entry in the edgelord list. Keyaru is one hell of an edgelord; maybe not the edgelord to end all edgelords, but damn is if he isn't trying. -- SilvoSwordo (talk) 23:32, 16 July 2021‎ (UTC)

No answer, so I'll use my best judgment and do just that. --SilvoSwordo (talk) 20:58, 23 August 2021 (UTC)

Are the Gor novels grimdark(derp)?[edit]

The Gor novels are a long-running series of Sword & Planet novels by John Norman that started out with the basic premise of "ordinary Earth guy is somehow transported to a Counter-Earth that is being overseen by insectoid aliens who have been stocking it with humans from different times and eras of history, but refusing them to develop any kind of industrial technology or gunpowder, and becomes a conquering warlord", ala the John Carter of Mars books, but quickly devolved into a combination political manifesto and blatant spanksheet about the author's obsession with macho manly men raping subservient women whenever they please. Like, even back in the late 60s and early 70s when the series was just getting started, people were getting creeped out about how much of these books revolves around sex slaves and guys raping them. When the protagonist was statted for AD&D in Giants in the Earth, it literally talked about how if he meets an "unfeminine" woman, he'll basically attempt to "fix" them by repeatedly beating them senseless and raping them. Also, there's actually a Gor RPG since 2017, so does Gor technically deserve an article on this wiki?--QuietBrowser (talk) 17:29, 23 August 2021 (UTC)

My thoughts:
  • Gor is Norman's magical-realm and doesn't count as grimdark, because Norman and his boner - and their demented fans - like it the way it is.
  • If there's a Gor RPG, Gor gets its own article. If it's shit, we'll mock it, like we mocked FATAL.
[UPDATE!] I've created John Norman and Gor (John Norman) pages. Because I'm awesome.
--Zimriel (talk) 21:24, 23 August 2021 (UTC)