Talk:Warhammer/Tactics/8th Edition/Dwarfs

On Runes

Throughout this article, Runes are brought up as being the superiour upgrades for Thanes and Lords and whatnot, but when you finally get to the runes, the only description available to about 80 % of them is "Do not take", "Not very good" or something similar, which, first of all isn't a valid description in an article about tactics (as it should describe how and why you should use it, not give orders), and secondly just can't be right, when the rest of the article is so positive about runes in general. Can someone who knows their Dwarfs and they Fantasy (aka: not me) try and do something about that, please? TheWiseDane (talk) 16:02, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

I've edited that section, I'm not sure who originally put it up but I'm not sure they've even played Dwarfs as they forget about a lot of the basics and even get a lot of the points costs wrong. -- Triacom (talk) 5:24, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

Ancestral Heirlooms & Runes

I've moved the combination part from the tactica to here because it's a lot more subjective than the rest of the tactica and I feel it's better to discuss the various builds here. -- Triacom (talk) 5:24, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

Rune Combinations & Character builds

Lord

• Great Weapon (6pts), Shield (3pts), Shieldbearers (40pts), 2x Rune of Iron (45pts), Rune of Fortitude (35pts), 3x Rune of Warding (45pts): T7, W6, 1+ Armour Save, 4++ Ward Save.

Great weapon of course doesn't work with shield, so only 2+ Armour save in CC --Jasko (talk) 11:35, 16 November 2018 (UTC)

That's pretty sexy. However, there is an alternative. Instead of 4++ Ward Save, get either:

• 2x Rune of Cleaving (35pts), Rune of Striking (10pts): WS8, S5, T7, W6, 1+ Armour Save and Armour Piercing, or:

• Rune of Cleaving (10pts), 2x Rune of Striking (35pts): WS8, T7, W6, 1+ Armour Save, Armour Piercing and re-roll failed To Hits.

Or you can take the advice of Bruenor from Bugman's and take:

• Shieldbearers (40pts), Master Rune of Snorri Spanglehelm (25pts), Rune of Might (25pts), Rune of Parrying (25pts), 3x Rune of Warding (45pts) and the all important Rune of Stone (5pts)

Netting you a Lord that's never hit on better than a 4+, always hits on a 2+, never wounds on worse than a 4+ and has a 1+/4++. This guy, for 310 points, has killed Archaon. I've never seen the build lose a challenge.

I have. Against a stupid Wood Elf Glade Captain with the Armour of Silvered Steel. I love that weapon but the weakness is low toughness opponents (worst is T4) with good AS. That Glade Captain didn't wound me either, but my Lord was last man standing against a unit, lost the CC, broke and was overrun. --Jasko (talk) 11:35, 16 November 2018 (UTC)

Runelord

• Anvil of Doom (170pts), Shield (3pts), Rune of Striking (10pts), Rune of Fortitude (35pts), Rune of Shielding (25pts), Rune of Stone (5pts), Master Rune of Balance (50pts), Rune of Spellbreaking (25pts): WS7, T6, W5, 2+ Armour Save, 5++ Ward Save / 3++ against damage from spells / 2++ against shooting attacks and magic missiles.
  Runelords are generally not worth taking unfortunately, except if you want to field the Anvil of Doom, which is also not as good as it used to be. So this build costs 443pts, which means you cannot field a fighter Lord in mid-sized games and your Runelord is just not up to the task. You'll need a Thane to fill that role. The Anvil provides decent protection (Ward Save 5++, +2W, unbreakable) but has the huge caveat that your Runelord is now a war machine and will therefore automatically fail any characteristic-test which is not toughness or leadership and therefore, in case of most spells forcing such a test, be killed outright with no saves of any kind allowed. Together with the inbuilt magic resistance 2 and the Rune of Shielding (and possibly an entrenched Anvil), your Runelord is pretty much impervious to ranged attacks, so you'll force your opponent into CC. The Rune of Striking will make it harder for WS3 and WS7 opponents to hit and with T6 and W5 he can take some punches, but it is still worthwhile to have a dedicated bodyguard (the actual Anvilguards will frighten a Great Eagle at best) around, maybe Hammerers. They can also take the Master Rune of Valaya to further your countermagic abilities, which at this point are already considerable: Bonus dispel dice for the Anvil, canalisation by the Runelord, stealing a power dice on 4+, dispel scroll. If you can field an additional Runesmith you can either take more Runes of Spellbreaking, maybe Level 2 to take a particularly dangerous spell out of play (namely everything forcing a characteristic test on your Runelord!), or make him a dispel caddy and invest more points on the CC-abilities of the Runelord. He will, however, never become a fearsome fighter unless you put the whole 150pts in it, at which point you should have just taken a Lord. A Runelord with Anvil of Doom is a fickle thing, use with caution.

Daemon Slayer

• 2x Rune of Cleaving (35pts), Rune of Striking (10pts): +1WS, +1S and Armour Piercing

• Rune of Cleaving (10pts), 2x Rune of Striking (35pts): Armour Piercing, +1WS and Re-Roll Failed To Hits.
  Rune of Striking gives you +1WS (so you're WS8) and Re-roll Failed To Hits. Which SHOULD apply to Deathblow special rule, where you make a single attack when you die.

• 3x Rune of Cleaving (65pts): A poor Slayer's Axe of Dargo, granting +1S, Armour Piercing and Killing Blow. You have S5 (S6 on the charge) and therefore at least a -3 Armour Save modifier. Characters can be struck down with Killing Blow, while monsters get D3 wounds.

• 3x Rune of Fury (100pts): +1A, Frenzy, successful hits cause another attack (once)
  All in all you have 6 attacks, which can go up to 12, at I5 which never wound on worse than a 4+, causes multiple wounds (D3) in monsters and all successful ward saves have to be re-rolled. It's great against chaff and monsters alike, and even the occasional character relying on ward saves can get into trouble (or all of the above: Hello Daemon Prince) Frenzy can be tricky though, you have to pass a LD test if you don't want to charge (at LD10, and usually your slayers want to get into combat anyway) and you have to pursue/overrun.

• Master Rune of Alaric the Mad (50pts), Rune of Fury (25pts), Grudge Rune (25pts): no Armour Saves allowed, +1A, +1 to hit and re-roll to wound against one (1) enemy character/monster (nominate at beginning of game)
  The main problem with the Slayer rule is the lack of armour save modifiers, and the main problem with the Master Rune of Alaric the Mad is that you only have S4. But they compliment each other quite well! Your opponent will try to evade your Daemon Slayer with the character/monster you have nominated for your Grudge Rune.

• MRo Swiftness (25pts), Ro Parrying (25pts), Ro Might (25pts): It gives ASF and with an initiative of 5 a good chance of re-rolling hits against many foes, -1 to hit the slayer, which combined with his WS7 means most enemy’s will only hit him on a 5+. This helps his survivability (especially if he’s striking first). The last rune gives him S8 vs foes with a T5 or higher. It helps get through that higher armour on some big gribblies and characters, though this rune can be interchangeable depending on your preference - Knoffles

Thane

• Tank Thanes: I find Thanes work best kitted out defensively with a Great Weapon. Put him on an Oath Stone if you like and upgrade one to a BSB.

• Master Rune of Gromril (30pts), 3x Rune of Warding (45pts), Great Weapon (6pts), Oath Stone (25pts): 1+ Armour Save, 4+ Ward Save. Solid as a rock, put him in a unit of Ironbreakers and let your enemy break himself there.

For a cheaper version of the above, drop the 3 * Ro warding and give him a Ro Iron (20pts) instead. Having 3 wounds is sometimes better than the 4+ Ward.

• Magnificent Armour of Borek Beetlebrow (65pts), either with Great Weapon (6pts) or Shield (3pts) and Rune of Fire/Cleaving/Striking (all 10pts).

• As a BSB, you can also get the Master Rune of Grungni (60pts) for a 4++ Ward Save and a 5++ Ward bubble against shooting in 6", inarguably a very useful rune. Unfortunately that means that you either have to make do with an inadequate 4+ Armour Save when you go for a Great Weapon, or are stuck with measly S4 attacks when you get a shield. Try having a second Thane or even Lord present in the unit.

• Thane o' Pain: There are a couple of weapon runes for 25pts each which can be combined quite freely for effective weapons. Be aware that you will only have an 3+ Armour Save with a shield and cannot parry with a magic weapon!

• Master Rune of Snorri Spangelhelm, Rune of Parrying, Rune of Might: always hit on 2+, -1 to hit for enemy, S8 against T5 and higher

• Master Rune of Swiftness, Rune of Fury, Grudge Rune: always strikes first, +1A, +1 to hit and re-roll to wound against one (1) enemy character/monster (nominate at beginning of game)

Runes of Parrying, Fury, Might and Grudge Rune can be exchanged, but the Grudge Rune does not work well with Runes of Spangelhelm and Might, because you cannot hit better than on 2+ and with S8 will most likely anyway wound on 2+, which also cannot be improved further.

Runesmith

• Rune of Spellbreaking (25pts), 2x Rune of Iron (45pts), Rune of Stone (5pts), Shield (3pts): T5, W3, 2+ Armour Save, 6++/5++ Parry Save, dispel scroll. Works best in a unit of Ironbreakers

• Master Rune of Balance (50pts), Rune of Spellbreaking (25pts): convert enemy power dice to dispel dice on 4+, dispel scroll

• Ro Spellbreaking (25pts), Ro Stone (5pts), shield (3pts), gives you the cheapest decent Runesmith. At 93pts it’s a bargain.

Dragon Slayer

• see Daemon Slayer and Thane o' Pain

Master Engineer

• Rune of Stone (5pts): Can't make a mistake with 3+ Armour Save. Not really much sense in giving him more, his job is fighting off the occasional war machine hunters at best. Better give him Brace of Dwarf Pistols and/or a Great Weapon.

Generic

• Mini-Thor - Master Rune of Flight and some runes of cleaving or burning. While not really that good, could be used for a bit of extra range.

• Thor (proper) - Master Rune of Flight and 2x Rune of Might. Costs 90 points but can give you two "free" hits on a monster (with Stand & Shoot, which of course also hits on 2+!) with S8 and multiple wounds (D3). Also never forget that the Rune of Might of course also works in CC.

• A neat Banner combo if you are taking a slayer army is to give your BSB the Master Rune of Grungni (which is BSB only) and give your slayers the Master Rune of Valaya (I run Ungrim Ironfist in the unit which gives them a 100pt banner allowance) if you stick your BSB in a unit and then sit that unit in front of your slayers then the slayers should be protected by the soft cover in front and the 5+ ward and this allows you to have 2 of the best Banner runes in one army.

• Rune of Fortitude (Level 2) is fantastic! Main page says you could get better ward saves elsewhere. Well, three: Master Rune of Grungni (only BSB of course), Borek Beetlebrow (only against S6) and Rune of Warding (Level 3). And after you have already spent 35 points for the Rune of Fortitude Level 1 to get that nice +1 Toughness, you get a 5++ Ward Save on top for just 15 points! That's a bargain, Rune of Warding (level 2) costs 35 points. --Jasko (talk) 15:27, 16 November 2018 (UTC)

• Rune of Warding (continued): ...or give him a Great Weapon. Or charge yourself. Or he is attacked in the side or rear. Or by impact hits or stomp. Or you want to make it into round two of combat. Or he is affected by magic. In a nutshell: Relying on parry saves for your Lord is insane. Who sends a Lord into combat with only a hand weapon anyway? --Jasko (talk) 15:27, 16 November 2018 (UTC)

War machines

Cannon. Well, the cannon is pretty easy. Slap a Rune of Forging (25pts) on it to re-roll those misfires on the artilley dice. A Rune of Burning can be great against flammable targets or to deny regeneration saves, but there is nothing worse than your opponent's general with the Dragonbane Gem shrugging off a direct hit and laughing in your face. Runes of Immolation or Disguise can be interesting but are usually not worth the costs.

Grudge Thrower needs Rune of Accuracy (25pts) and highly benefits from Rune of Penetrating (40pts). You'll definitely want to be able to re-roll the scatter dice and your Grudge Thrower needs more power. The direct hit is as good with S9 as it is with S10, but the S3 or S4 for the other hits under the template makes a huge difference. An additional Rune of Forging (25pts) lets you re-roll misfires on the artillery dice as usual and is always welcome.

Bolt Thrower with Rune of Penetrating (40pts), Rune of Accuracy (25pts) and Flakkson's Rune of Seeking (15pts). Yes, a Bolt Thrower, even with all the black powdered goodness at your disposal. With those runes your Bolt Thrower will cost you 125pts, which seems a lot, given that you'll get a cannon at 5 points less. So why use a Bolt Thrower? Well first of all, Bolt Throwers don't suffer misfires. They either hit or they don't, but they'll never blow up. They also have a long range of 48" which means that they can hit anything that leaves your opponent's deployment zone, depending on placement, at 3+ (thanks to the Rune of Accuracy). Together, this frees up your Master Engineer to assist your other war machines (Organ Gun!). I regularly face flying monsters with breath weapons, and I've written the names of many a good Hammerer in my Book of Grudges because of them. This is where Flakkson's Rune of Seeking comes into play, where your Bolt Thrower will hit them on 2+ (within 24"). Thanks to the Rune of Penetrating (S7) you'll wound most of them on 2+ and the rest on 3+, T7 is incredibly rare. Their scaly skin (if any) won't help them and you'll cause multiple wounds D3. You will not kill them in one shot, but they probably won't survive 2-3 shots either, so they will have to deal with your Bolt Thrower first. And if there are no flyers around, you still have a very reliable (again, no misfires!) war machine with rank-penetrating S7 shots, no Armour Saves allowed, which hit pretty decently at a reasonable price.

Organ Gun with Rune of Accuracy (25pts) and Rune of Forging (25pts). Tops your Organ Gun out at 170pts. Your Organ Gun now effectively has BF4 and you can re-roll a misfire on one of those artillery dice. Having one misfire now is not as bad as it used to be anymore (no damage to your gun, but all shots from that other dice have a -1 to hit modifier), but given that your enemy will do anything in his power to silence your Organ Gun, you'll need any round of shooting you can get. It's still worth it to get a Master Engineer though, as he effectively gives you BF5 (BF4 from the engineer and +1 to hit for the rune) and he lets you re-roll the other artillery dice. It's also worth remembering that, while the Rune of Accuracy lets you re-roll a misfire, the engineer's Artillery Master lets you re-roll any result on the dice (can't re-roll a re-roll of course). A naked Master Engineer (which is perfectly fine to field) will add another 70pts to the war machine, but of course also gives you Entrenchment (hard cover for your Organ Gun and a bonus if charged) and he can also help other war machines. Give the engineer a (brace of) pistol(s) and/or a great weapon and Rune of Stone and he can tip the scales in your favor if your opponent's war machine hunter is something light. At this point you've spent 250pts on this one war machine, but you have 30" threat range with BF5 and re-rolls on both artillery dice, aim for well armoured unit or a monster (or a carelessly lone character of course!) and watch it be torn to shreds.

Flame Cannon. Ah, now that's not easy. It's always wise to get a Rune of Forging (25ps) to re-roll misfires on the artillery dice. On the other hand, a Rune of Penetrating (40pts) gives you a S6 flame thrower which is just brutal, given how great template weapons are. You can't have both, so if you have a Master Engineer lying around, go for S6 and watch the world burn. Literally. Hrnf, only Grimm Burloksson allows to re-roll misfires of the artillery dice for Flame Cannons. Well, if you can field him, great (although he is also pretty mean in combination with Organ Guns or Irondrakes), otherwise you'll have to chose between a more reliable Flame Cannon with Rune of Forging (also keep in mind the additional -1 on the black powder misfire chart when supercharging your shot!) and a more devastating one with the Rune of Penetrating. Either way, a well placed shot can delete an entire unit in a single round.

Anvil of Doom

Overall it is generally not worth it to take the Anvil of Doom. But it is not all bad and might, depending on the situation, be useful.

Pros

• adds 2 Wounds to the Runelord, unbreakable, 5++ Ward Save (works well with Runelords inbuilt magic resistance 2) and Anvil Guard attacks (WS5, S4, I2, A2)

• one additional power and dispel dice

• Runes are innate bound spells: No miscast table or damage to the Anvil upon irresistible force, just cannot cast a second one this turn.

• Unit type is war machine: Cannot be stomped/thunderstomped, immune to killing blow, only five models can attack in close combat, can be entrenched

Cons

• Unit type is war machine: Cannot join a unit (Forgefire is lost, no protection), no Look Out Sir!, automatically fails characteristics test (except toughness and leadership) so instantly killed by Pit of Shades/Dwellers Below/Purple Sun etc.

• cannot move and strike runes

• 170pts + 120pts Runelord + mandatory runic items means you cannot field a strong Lord in <3000pts games.

Striking the Runes

Once you have dispelled all spells remaining in play, you can spend all leftover power dice on casting runes with little caution, there is no real downside to irresistible force. And since you don’t add any wizard level but your opponent will, use as many dice as you can and hope for IF.

• Rune of Hearth and Home: Would be great in almost any other army, Dwarfs have LD9, usually not needed.

• Rune of Oath and Steel: Fantastic!

• Rune of Wrath and Ruin: Great! Direct Damage spells don’t need line of sight to the target, just something in the front arc, so go get anything trying to sneak around your army under cover.

When and how to field it

• In anti-magic lists. Anvil of Doom adds dispel dice and needs Runelord, who is only worth taking for his 150pts of runic items and will never be a great fighter, spend points on armour and talismanic runes. Combine with Master Rune of Valaya and a second Runesmith to shut down enemy magic phase.

• Properly kitted out Runelord on Anvil of Doom is all but impervious to ranged attacks. Regular war machine hunters (fast cavalry, small flyers, scouts) will have a hard time in close combat. Flying monsters probably need more than one turn (cannot thunderstomp) but will eventually win. Real threats are strong characters on flying monsters and certain spells (i.e. Pit of Shades/Dwellers Below/Purple Sun). Dispatch a dedicated bodyguard unit.

• Your Runelord on Anvil of Doom does not need line of sight for anything. Park him buried behind your army or ideally some obstacles and make it harder for your enemy to get to him.

Synergy and general Tactics

• Irondrakes: Even more fun are these together with Grimm Burloksson in their ranks next to an Organ Gun. With Superior Volley they can re-roll missed To Hit rolls, otherwise he can do Artillery Adjustment and Entrenchment on the Gun.