Talk:Your Dudes

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Could we add a gallery of unique "dudes"? I recently found this http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/uploads/1356396128/gallery_37532_5399_46751.jpg according to the creator, it's a Marines Maleficent with a 75mm cannon acting as a Mercury Pattern Recoiless Rifle. I know there are plenty of people with unique Squads, Units, Chapters, etc. who would like to show them off, and plenty of people who would want to see them.

Source for image: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/214217-glory-and-hate-a-marines-malevolent-project/page-44

...

Following the link to this page at the bottom of Advancing the Storyline was probably the most frustration-relieving revelations I've had on this wiki. The change in attitude about the game... It fixes everything. I'll keep this in mind, and start playing my Nids with more of a narrative turn of mind. Thanks for the tip.

--Oogalook (talk) 18:56, 19 July 2015 (UTC)

  • Happy to see a fellow gamer finding the truth C; I too found this some time back, and I immideatly changed outlook on the games I was playing - Now I craft my miniatures because I have a concept for them, and want a physicaly representation of the characters I had devised, so I see what ya mean :D
Also, check out Kill Team, Heralds of Ruin Ed. "Your Dudes" in game form. TheWiseDane (talk) 19:32, 19 July 2015 (UTC)
Since I've never actually engaged in the game itself, I've never cared too much for the "Your Dudes" philosophy, and I'd like to present a much-needed counterargument.
The idea of focusing on only one tiny group in a vast setting is hopelessly nearsighted, and with GW being GW there's a constant risk of them deciding that anything at all that might have happened to your dudes in a game is now retconned. How can you make your own stories for them when there's a guy constantly saying "nope, you follow our story and fuck you if we don't agree with what happened to the gameplay". Keep in mind that Tycho was WD's character- if it was from literally anyone else, he would have been totally forgotten by everyone other than his player. He should be considered the exception, not the rule.
It also feels like it's pointless to push for an evolving story when it has nowhere for it to evolve within the confines of the fluff which it ostensibly builds on. In spite of the page's claims, fluff is not the background material, it IS the story. Claiming otherwise is like saying fanfiction should take precedence over the works that the fanfic was actually based on- it's presumptuous and fails to acknowledge that any such "emergent story" so produced is ultimately a derivative that can be functionally erased on somebody else's whims.
And really, if your dudes do so little that their presence wouldn't be missed if they suddenly vanished without a trace, what was the point of having them around at all? They may as well never have existed, and their story is rendered irrelevant. The fact that they're in such a big setting must by definition render them tiny and insignificant in the long run, and if they somehow do make a difference it'll be highly unlikely to leave a lasting impact unless it impresses the official writers enough to let it stay. And if THAT happens...well, they won't be your dudes anymore. They'll be just one more part of the fluff.--Newerfag (talk) 19:50, 19 July 2015 (UTC)
I see why you'd say this, but you assume a few thing that aren't really important to the term.
First off: Your Dudes does not have an effect on the setting at large, but that's part of the beauty. You can easily make your own little sector with your own little factions vying for power, which /tg/ has already done with the Tiji Sector. You already have the background work for the setting, now you can carve out an area of the map, where each encounter, each battle and each character is important. To most, it isn't important to have big hero or villian characters within the larger setting, just to have one somewhere. Besides, the 40k setting is Grimdark, which, by definition, means that the individual, no matter how much of a hero they are, can't change shit.
Second: To the average Your Dudes gamer, it isn't important to have anything set in stone. There's a bit of a want to be an author in it, to be able to create something that fits with the setting in a good way. Nobody can take that sort of creations away from you, and if someone else makes up something that hurts your creations, you can just ignore him. Nothing changes, it's still how you want it to be.
The most important thing to remember about settings to me is, that there are as many variations of the same setting as there are fans of it. Each and every one of us have our own view on the 40k setting, which shapes the way we see it, and how it is formed in our minds. This is likely not the same as other fans' versions of the universe, but that doesn't make them wrong, it's just different, because they themselves are different. Therefor, when a fan makes His Dudes, it's because he wants to shape and form the setting by creating something closer to what he personally envisioned for the setting. It creates a sort of ownership over a public setting to say "This is the Carthagos Sector, and here are the WAAAGH of Warboss Facepuncha, the Necrons of the Sahraliaka Dynasty, the Void Marauders Renegade Chapter and the Rogue Trader Army of Roy Benkilstein.".
And yes, that is my group's Dudes, and it's our personal playground within the 40k setting. Without it, we would just be playing with Transformers or playing Call of Duty - With it, it's our own thing, and we own it. TheWiseDane (talk) 20:16, 19 July 2015 (UTC)


I play the game a good bit, but only with a handful of people. I find it deeply gratifying when they recognize a tactic that always hinges on the actions of a certain favorite model of mine, for instance my Jive Flyrant (converted with wicked beak, wings, and sunglasses) or else Hannibal Lictor (now Counting As Deathleaper because of his sweet new rules).
I've been hesitant to put much thought into the story between my games, which are often chaotic or unlikely, but what is so appealing about the "Your Dudes" philosophy is that we can attach ourselves to our units and game actions in the same way that D&D players get into their characters. I don't feel like I need to make the exploits of my ridiculous splinter fleet a major internet joke, but neither do I have to treat the game as a dry tactical simulation.--Oogalook (talk) 20:35, 19 July 2015 (UTC)
Yeah. Someone who just reads the fluff without engaging in the game itself would understandably want the authors to advance the metaplot. It is like a book with no sequel. However, to those that engage in the wargame, or just have PCs in some RPG, the plot IS the fan-fiction of what the player is doing. The authors provide the setting. When the setting canonically ends (old WoD, Exalted to a lesser extent) some people get pissed off. The counterargument is probably that you could ignore whatever official materials are produced, but that gets more into the discussion of why having an official setting at all is useful. Tournament legality is a big point in favor of a shared setting in Warhammer's case (people can only take so much Counts As).--71.47.208.127 20:40, 19 July 2015 (UTC)


I think I see what you mean, though it feels to me like I wouldn't get much enjoyment out of that kind of thing when all my actions in the greater scheme of things are pointless. I need to make my dudes' actions truly matter beyond my own personal headcanon. I don't deny the appeal of it, but it would be nice to have someone from the outside actually confirm that yes, your dudes exist and they're more than just something you made up one day. And while I get the logic of ignoring things that hurt your own creations, that runs into problems when those creations begin directly contradicting the fluff. Just look at what happened to Oldcron fans when the advent of Newcrons put their personal stories at odds with the setting as a whole. Something has to give, and that something is inevitably the fans's versions of the setting. I'm just not comfortable with that possibility that all my work on my dudes could be rendered moot because of someone saying that the enemy forces my dudes were fighting against were in a completely different part of the galaxy at the time (for example). And that's not factoring in named characters who ARE part of the fluff that might be killed off or retconned out at any time...
But as much as I'd like the metaplot to advance, seeing GW's current skill at that in Age of Sigmar has convinced me that any such changes now would bring nothing but trouble. Better for them to flesh out what's already there first and hope their writing skills suck less when they do go ahead with it. That, or making up my own version of things with the knowledge that just because I'd like it to end that way doesn't mean that it will be that way when the metaplot does advance. --Newerfag (talk) 21:01, 19 July 2015 (UTC)
Your thoughts about exporting stories from your head into peers' heads is not uncommon. Validation is instrumental in a creative excercise, improving the perceived legitimacy of a construct. Big talky words aside, working with a group of friends and building your story alongside theirs satisfies thoroughly, though naturally special little flowers are less readily accepted than half-joke characters (vis Hannibal Lictor). Have you ever played D&D? This goes for everybody: try D&D. The creative process is welcoming and fluid. The same can go for 40k with the Your Dudes philosophy.--Oogalook (talk) 21:31, 19 July 2015 (UTC)
No, I haven't actually played DnD (though again I have a fairly good theoretical knowledge of the fluff) or any other RPG at that matter; I practically live in a cave as far as the "nearest" LGS is, and with nobody to actually play a game with the characters I come up with can only interact with other characters I also make, and I don't fancy being both a DM and a player at the same time. Hence the fanfic thing that I mentioned earlier. It's not the best solution, but it still lets me have my cake and eat it too since it definitively allows me to carve out parts of the setting as mine while accepting the fact that they could be rendered irrelevant at any time. It also helps that the way the story goes isn't ultimately at the mercy of a bad skill check or a botched invulnerable save. If a character dies, it'll be on my terms and not due to simple random chance.--Newerfag (talk) 21:41, 19 July 2015 (UTC)
Give not up, my friend. Letting go of the full narrative control is tough- that's my main struggle when DMing. But the game dice and fellow players make a social imagination game take on some of the intractable wantonness of life, as well as adding some of the truth and weight of a story that really happened. Anything can happen in a good work of fiction; anything can still happen in a D&D session, but when it does, it happens despite everything else that could have happened. Narrative structure is important to fiction, but the added realism and weight of events outside the storyteller's (or DM's) control makes a tale smack of a true struggle in a truer world, especially for those involved. What I mean is, the interactive, off-the-cuff, multiplayer storytelling that is a good RPG (or 40K with rollplaying for lulz) takes on a life of its own. Though the creator can still steer a bit, he's got a real chance to get sucked into eddies and discover possibilities he would never have considered.
TL;DR Try D&D. Can't guarantee that other 40K players will get into narrative-building as described, but to experience good RP and to participate in it is a uniquely life-changing experience for the imaginative intellectual. Drop in on a session at your local Nerd congregation store, like a comic book shop; If they'll take you, trust in Gygax and have a blast. Cheers, friend.
--Oogalook (talk) 03:27, 20 July 2015 (UTC)
Therein is the problem. No such nerd congregation store exists even remotely near me. No players means no game, so even if I tried a different RPG like Dark Heresy where I was already invested in the setting it would equate to nothing more than mental masturbation. So what do I do? --Newerfag (talk) 03:46, 20 July 2015 (UTC)
One cannot solve another's living-in-Antarctica troubles XD Sorry bout that man. People who are hella-remote might consider playing online with internet-style friends, I say! If you have some olden-days type friends who you're in interweb contact with, you can get a pretty damn good experience of D&D via Roll20.net. It's got VOIP and a game-board on a server that players log in to (fo frizzles YEAH), with dice macros and grid-squares and rulers and models and crap out the wazoo. I've used it for little games of 40k, even, though there may be a better online tool for that. Cheers, friend!--Oogalook (talk) 04:48, 20 July 2015 (UTC)

I don't know if it is relevant enough to be put on this page but the Chapter Approved 2018 included tables of suggestions of extra abilities to customise one's characters and other units (separate tables for non-characters). Those are not usable in matched play but I find it interesting nonetheless.